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To: Sonny M

Speaking as an electrical engineer, IMHO its a societal thing. American society values occupations that manage and redistribute wealth but not those who create wealth. Lawyers, and brokers are deitified but engineers, designers, and the trades are seen as "geeky."

Its mainly an Anglosphere thing. US, Canada, Australia, UK, NZ. For instance lawyers just do not have that much status in the rest of the world. There are 1,000,000 lawyers in the US which is about 70% of the worlds supply for a nation with about 25% of the worlds economy.

Germany and Japan are the opposite. Engineering and design are the elite jobs there and it shows. BMW and Sony anyone? Siemens and Matsushima?
China and India also value design and engineering and it shows.

There is one thing that will keep the US on top. Creativity. We are the most creative in the world.

You reap what you sow.


20 posted on 12/20/2005 2:49:59 PM PST by rasblue (Everyone has their price)
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To: rasblue
Speaking as an electrical engineer, IMHO its a societal thing. American society values occupations that manage and redistribute wealth but not those who create wealth. Lawyers, and brokers are deitified but engineers, designers, and the trades are seen as "geeky."

This lawyer thing goes back at least to the days of '49 gold rush, where astute observers noted that a person could make as much money disputing mining claims as actually mining gold.
23 posted on 12/20/2005 3:18:23 PM PST by Milhous (Sarcasm - the last refuge of an empty mind.)
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To: rasblue

Alright, PEs, in my field the journal articles are written almost exclusively by asians, no doubt supporting research for their faculty advisor. Very very little of the information is of any use whatsoever in actual practice. Some of the information is innately inconsequential, because of the other variables in construction. How important is it to model an answer to +/- 3.5% accuracy if the assumed loads are +/-15%. It is not how many answers you get, or how accurate the answer if you dont ask the right questions. I have a friend and mentor, East European, who taught engineering at night for a major state university. 20 years ago, 3 or 4 sets of answers to his assignments. Farsi, Chinese, Urdu, all the same solutions. OK, so they work together, or one carries all. But he said it was because they could study engineering without speaking English.


26 posted on 12/20/2005 3:41:14 PM PST by BuglerTex
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To: rasblue
Germany and Japan are the opposite. Engineering and design are the elite jobs there and it shows. BMW and Sony anyone? Siemens and Matsushima? China and India also value design and engineering and it shows.

From SOCIAL STATUS point of view I agree with you that Engineers fair better in these countries. However Engineers in the US are still payed better than their counterpart in Germany and Japan, I know this since our company have branches in Japan and Western Europe, and our engineers in the US with make 25% to 30% more in salaries than our counterpart with same position in Western Europe and Japan. Also American Engineers have vastly more resources for R&D, and design than those in Western European and more than those Japan.

Of course it is not worth comparing our engineers salaries and access for R & D and design to those of China and India, it is a joke to do so, and that why every Chinese and Indian engineers ultimate dream is to come and work in the US.

51 posted on 12/20/2005 6:40:59 PM PST by jveritas (The Axis of Defeatism: Left wing liberals, Buchananites, and third party voters.)
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To: rasblue
"American society values occupations that manage and redistribute wealth but not those who create wealth. Lawyers, and brokers are deitified......"

The U.S. has been using this approach for over 200 years (i.e. as the U.S. has expanded Westward and filled-out its territory), but in the long run it's not a model for survival.

In contrast, in China, each member of the Politburo Standing Committe is an Engineer or Scientist. The push for excellence in Science & Engineering comes from the top down.
52 posted on 12/20/2005 6:49:44 PM PST by indthkr
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To: rasblue
"There is one thing that will keep the US on top. Creativity. We are the most creative in the world. "

Agreed. We also are light years ahead in the illustrious fields of sociology, minority studies, and tolerance and diversity studies.
61 posted on 12/21/2005 8:04:37 AM PST by GunnyHartman (Allah is allah outta virgins.)
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