2nd KU class denies status of science to design theory

Lawrence Journal-World ^ | Sunday, November 27, 2005 | Sophia Maines

[moog]

don't share your beliefs but I respect your right to believe and worship as you choose. The irony is that I am an atheist who spends a lot his of time responding to unthinking attacks on Christians (and Christianity) from smug, condescending idiots who don't understand its value or depth. The Enlightenment represented the secularization of Judaeo-Christian moral values. Without the moral framework provided by the church, Western Civilization may be headed for trouble, but for me, that doesn't make religion true.

I respect your beliefs and agree with some of your opinions here too. I don't like attacks against Christianity any more than anyone does, though sometimes some of the worst attacks come from one Christian against another--some of the religion threads I've seen are evidence of that. I respect any God-fearing, humble Christian striving to do what's right. And I respect ANYONE who tries to live their life with integrity and forthrightness.

My faith is what makes my religion true to me and the many experience I've had that are demonstrations of that faith. However, those are mine and mine alone. Each person has to develop his faith/beliefs for himself.

You seem like a person I can respect.

[CarolinaGuitarman]

"Yeah, and I'll bet you play New Age."

Never heard of it.

[Alter Kaker]

I guarantee you, we're not all the same person.

Oh yes we are! And our name is Bob.

[moog]

"We have nothing to argue about."

HEHE. That's why I am not looking to get into an argument here. I'm here to learn what I can from views different from my own.

[Coyoteman]

Race is largely irrelevent from an anthropological standpoint, because variation within races is much greater than variation between races.

Right. Most of what is called race is simply adaptation to different climates. Has little to do with descent. To track descent you need DNA, etc.

[CarolinaGuitarman]

"Oh yes we are! And our name is Bob."

That's very close. :)

See ya later, Bob!

[moog]

The current races are most certainly not subspecies. You have just demonstrated that you have zero knowledge of biology. Variation within races is greater than variation between races, which means they're not subspecies. Humans ourselves are the last surviving subspecies of the species Homo sapiens -- which also at one point included Archaic Homo sapiens, Homo sapiens idaltu , Homo heidelbergensis, Neandertals, and, quite possibly, H. erectus/ergaster.

Sorry bud, that's why I differentiated between humans and animals because we use the term race differently than subspecies when we apply it to humans. With animals, we often don't.

[js1138]

That is stuff that has changed a LOT since 1928.

What about quantum theory has changed since 1928?

[Senator Bedfellow]

I'm sure I don't know what you mean by "phoney" - you don't expect me to believe that "Mamzelle" is your name, do you?

Anyway, no thread to post for now - you know what I'm talking about, and that's quite enough for the moment.

[RunningWolf]

Welcome to the aliceinwonderland of evo. From a few there, every declaration should be inverted to take the reciprocal for a real meaning

In both the fossils and the DNA, whether one sees evolution is in the interpretation. Interpretation is not reality. This is not meant as a diss to science.

Remember, here is how it works from them. Evolution is already decided to be fact by the evos (even though to be pc they must call it a theory) but how it happened is all theory, or a conglomeration of contemporary fad theories.

So evolution happened, but all theories are unproven, and the glacier of evidence in the theories makes evolution as much a fact as the theory of gravity.

the evo Magic 8 Ball DOH!!

This is a wonderfully elegant solution for them that always returns back an answer of evolution.

Wolf

[blowfish]

--this is a team of juveniles at work in FR who care little to nothing about conservatism.

Nonsense. What could be more conservative than expecting science to be determined by solid evidence and well reasoned arguments that are critically debated? When ID can produce something resembling scientific evidence it can be discussed as science. Until then its just mythology.

[Coyoteman]

this is a team of juveniles at work in FR

That is Dr. Juvenile to you. And I think you just made my VI list as well.

[blowfish]

but all theories are unproven, and the glacier of evidence in the theories makes evolution as much a fact as the theory of gravity.

Actually, the statement is pretty much spot-on, and explains why ID can't get any traction in the scientific community.

[CarolinaGuitarman]

" That is Dr. Juvenile to you. And I think you just made my VI list as well."

Bob,

But, we're all the same person, remember? If she's on one of our VI lists, wouldn't she be on all of ours? It's like thinking about time travel, gives me a headache... :)

Bob

[bobdsmith]

actually theories of gravity are far less solid than the theory of evolution

[Mamzelle]

There's about as much science to your ersatz "debates" as there is enlightenment to a conversation between Beevis and Butthead--it's all about one of you guys starting in with an unsuspecting FRer who thinks your offerings are in good faith.

They're not. They're about getting your little clique together for a sneer-fest.

You don't participate in the wider threads. You don't even indulge in a chat about a movie. You're just here to find someone you can call stupid. I guess, so your little club can feel really smart?

[rootkidslim]

I think I qualified my statement by saying "if you believe" Rushton, and he certainly does argue that. You are welcome to peruse the many papers he has posted in pdf format on his site to which I linked and decide for yourself if his assertions are credible. I'm not qualified to state with certainty, but I thought the idea that Neanderthal Man was H. Sapiens Neanderthalensis was refuted by DNA evidence retrieved from Neanderthal bones.

[Thatcherite]

I guarantee you, we're not all the same person.

Liar! Yes we are. I do all the evo posts, imbetween marching in pink-parades, attending anti-globalisation rallies, protesting against Bush's evil war of agression in Iraq, and handing out animal-rights-leaflets. I also write a lot of the stupider creationist posts too, to make the creationists look even more foolish than they look without my help; Oh wait... mamzelle... these split personalities can get real tricky. I am you too.

[moog]

What about quantum theory has changed since 1928?

Like I said, I'm not an expert. Some of the examples that I gave may or may not apply to quantum physics, but they certainly are relatively new developments. A LOT in science has changed since 1928, that's for sure. Even if quantum physics has not basically changed since then, it has come more into being in the last few years.

[Mamzelle]

C'mon, Bedfellow, what previous incarnation on FR are you?