Turkey and Denmark clash over press freedom

KRG, Kurdish Regional Government ^ | 16 Nov 2005 | Teresa Küchler

[dajudem]

Turkey and Denmark clash over press freedom

Turkish prime minister Tayyip Erdogan boycotted a joint press conference with the Danish leader in protest at the presence of a Kurdish TV station on Tuesday (15 November), highlighting European values on free speech.

"There is a fundamental difference between Turkey and Denmark in matters of freedom of expression," the Danish prime minister Anders Fogh Rasmussen said at the press conference his Turkish counterpart avoided.

The Turkish prime minister was visiting the Danish capital Copenhagen as the first stop in a tour around EU capitals to discuss the prospects of Turkey's EU membership.

Mr Erdogan stayed away from the press conference in protest at the presence of a journalist from the Danish-based TV channel Roj TV.

Turkey has repeatedly urged Denmark to close the channel, which sends news, entertainment, debate and children's' programs to Kurds in Denmark, arguing it is financed by the Kurdish rebel party, the PKK, which is on the EU's list of terrorist organisations.

Danish police are investigating the station, but have not found evidence of links to forbidden organisations so far.

Mr Rasmussen said he regretted that Mr Erdogan did not attend the press conference, but pointed out that excluding the Kurdish TV-station from the conference would have violated the principles of freedom of expression in the European Union, which Turkey aspires to join.

He added that Turkey must realise that there are a few strict conditions that have to be fulfilled if Turkey wants to join the EU one day.

Turkish-Danish relations sore

Ironically, the official visit of Tayyip Erdogan to Denmark was aimed at improving relations between the two countries following a two-month row over press freedom and Islam.

[dajudem]

A New Site has been set up called Save ROJ TV -It is 'an independent initiative' & allows visitors to express their support for the Kurdish satellite Television ROJ TV. Please lend your support! FREEPER ACTION NEEDED!

http://rojtv.blogspot.com/

[Prime Choice]

Turkish prime minister Tayyip Erdogan boycotted a joint press conference with the Danish leader in protest at the presence of a Kurdish TV station on Tuesday (15 November), highlighting European values on free speech.

Yet another reason why Turkey is not fit to join even the Euro-peon "Union."

[ketelone]

Yeah well, I wouldnt go to a press conference with a prime minister who is yapping away telling me how to run things in my country either.

The turks probably do far more to keep terrorism under the heel than the Danes do.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

RE: "The turks probably do far more to keep terrorism under the heel than the Danes do."

You're right!

The Turkish Army knows how to deal with radical Islam also. It's the Army's duty to protect the Turkish secular republic from extremists. They've done it a few times. There's a difference between a Muslim country and a country of Muslims.

And now on to some comments about the posted article. Here's some info on the "rest of the stroy" about Roj and the PKK.

http://kurdistanobserver.servehttp.com/nov/6-11-05-tky-slams-denmark-roj-tv.htm

"Turkey has previously succeeded in ensuring the closure of two other Europe-based Kurdish television stations. MED-TV had its license revoked in Britain while France refused to grant a license to its successor, MEDYA-TV."

So why did France and Britain do this? Did they have evidence that the PKK Marxists were associated with these TV stations just like Turkey says?

More..

"The Danish Radio and Television Board ruled earlier this year that the station's programmes did not contain incitement, but said it had asked police to look into alleged ties between Roj TV and the PKK."

PKK has been stirring up violence in eastern Turkey again.

Another article.

http://kurdistanobserver.servehttp.com/nov/21-11-05-us-calls-denmark-shut-down-roj-tv.htm

"Washington Calls For Denmark To Shut Down Kurdish TV station"

"'Given their inflammatory programming (and) their links to the PKK front group, we believe these entities should not enjoy a safe haven in Denmark,'" said the U.S. letter.

"Justice Minister Lene Espersen said on Monday that the letter from Washington had been handed to Danish police, who are conducting an investigation into Roj TV's alleged ties with the Kurdish rebellion."

Where's the outrage from Kurdistan? There probably ain't none. As best I can remember they are not too fond of the PKK either.

a google search of

site:kurdistanobserver.servehttp.com roj

found no criticism, just news stories and some comments about getting information to the 10 million Kurds in Iran using two other TV outlets.

[armydawg1]

I guess the Turkish Prime Minister made a good first impression on his tour of European capitols to get his country into the EU.....

Here's a hint for the Turks: If they had wanted some influence over the Kurds, they should have sided with the US in Iraq and allowed the northern front. But they didnt and now they whine about the Kurds. How about some cheese with that Whine?

[Savage Beast]

"There is a fundamental difference between Turkey and Denmark in matters of freedom of expression."

But not for long, Anders!

[dajudem]

It is the Turkish Prime Minister telling the Danish one how to run his country! The Danes found nothing out-of-the ordinary with the Kurdish language broadcast. As for the Turks keeping terrorism down, they are good at calling any group agitating for more freedom and democracy, "terrorism." Where were they when Bush 1 wanted to use a part of Turkey for the assault upon Iraq? Read about the history of Kurds in Turkey and check the history of Kurds in Iraq. The Kurds have been our friends in Iraq and in the section of Iraq that is Kurdish have established a model 'democracy'. Look with skepticism on the Turkish "line".

[dajudem]

It is not so much that Turkey is "dealing with radical Islam" but that they are using the issue to do 'military operations' against the Turkish Kurds.

The US State Dept does not always 'do the right thing' --eg for example it has constantly agitated in favor of the Arab position in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict, thus making matters worse.

The average American is hardly aware of the constant harrassment of Kurds as MSM doesn't deal with this issue. It took US a long time to accept and deal with Saddam's gassing of the Kurds. Probably millions of Americans only think of the Kurds as "his own people" as in "Saddam gassed 'his own people'".

Turkey: Sharp Increase In Human Rights Abuses Reported

From: Ozgur Politika in Turkish June 10, 2005

Diha/Amed [Diyarbakir]: Diyarbakir Branch of the Human Rights Association (IHD) has said that a total of 2,262 violations of human rights occurred and 140 people were killed in clashes in the Kurdish-populated provinces in March, April and May. There was a drastic increase in human rights abuses in the past three months.

IHD Diyarbakir Branch unveiled its reports about human rights violations observed in the Kurdish-populated provinces in March, April and May 2005. In a statement he made at the headquarters of the branch, Selahattin Demirtas, head of the branch, said that "there had been a drastic increase" in human rights violations in the past three months as compared with the previous periods, adding that a total of 147 people had been killed in hostilities since the beginning of 2005, including 140 killed over the past three months.

http://home.cogeco.ca/~kobserver/19-6-05-rise-human-abuses-tky.htm

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Thank you for your polite, well-reasoned response.

There are millions of Kurds in Turkey. They are well-integrated into society. When modern Turkey was founded in 1923 tough measures were required to "reform" Islam and build a secular country modeled after western countries.

It may be an oversimplification but I believe that following W.W.I borders were assigned by western powers. One tough measure of Mustafa Kemal Ataturk's was, everyone within Turkey's borders had to be a Turk or else.

I am not aware of your opinion of the Marxist PKK. To the best of my memory the ruling Kurd parties, PUK and PDK, consider the PKK outlaws and dangerous. Our own government has long classified them as terrorists.

If I remember correctly we promised Turkey that we'd destroy PKK stongholds in the northern Iraq mountains if Turkey would promise not to send massive numbers of troops into Iraq to get the PKK.

It is the PKK (they have a new name, I believe) that is stirring violence in eastern Turkey. Do their violent acts against Turkey citizens count?

And what of the growing economic integration of Iraqi Kurdistan and Turkey? Would not the PUK and PDK back their "oppressed" countrymen if Turkey was doing them wrong?

[ketelone]

All sounds a bit complicated. Wasnt Ataturks idea essentially to kick out the Greeks who had inveaded from the west, rather than any Kurdish threat to the east?

AFAIK, he left Greece practically on the point of collapse, because the Greeks on their own were no match for the Turkish armies, and the British and French were too tired of war to want to do anything about it.

[dajudem]

You make some interesting points I would like to respond to.

I agree that there are millions of Kurds in Turkey, and many of them are assimilated. But the Turks do not have the tolerant society that we find here, and Kurdish language, culture and identity is (actively) stamped out in an attempt to homogenize the entire population and enforce 'assimilation'. As you say so well: "One tough measure of Mustafa Kemal Ataturk's was, everyone within Turkey's borders had to be a Turk or else." That "or-else" policy is still happening with the Kurdish, which includes military actions.

The Kurds in Iraq are not causing anyone a problem because they are being integrated and accepted as semi-autonomous. It is only in Turkey that they are a problem. While it is true that the US has classed the PKK as a terror group, it is also true that they classed the JDL (Jewish Defense League) similarly, which is a mite ridiculous, considering. (The two Jewish 'terrorists' who have been arrested have already died mysteriously in jail). As for the PKK, while I do not advocate terror, one does have to occasionally recognize the right of oppressed people to have some avenue to make themselves heard, and it is my understanding that the Kurdish rebels in Turkey do not attack civilian targets.

I have read that they honor the Geneva Convention Accords and have until recently honored a unilateral 'ceasefire' for a number of years against the Turks. Finally, I believe that their 'demands' are reasonable, and basically the Kurdish merely want what we would call our 'civil rights', and pose no threat to the Turkey as a sovereign state.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

As usual you have some good points. I guess we'll just have to disagree on some things. BTW, I worked for about three years with some Turks including almost a year in Ankara where I met many more. Mighty fine people. Everyone of them would be great Americans.

On a different subject where you will get no argument from me..

RE: "The two Jewish 'terrorists' who have been arrested have already died mysteriously in jail."

I remain outraged at both murders.

For decades I have been interested in similar "suicides" and strange deaths.

They were killed one way or another by powers that be.

(Partial list)

Irv Rubin

Earl Krugel

Vince Foster (suicide? OK. But why? Waco? The tainted blood? Why? Did covering up for the Clintons for years finally get to him?)

Henry Marshall, USDA inspector who was about to nail Billie Sol Estes (and LBJ? Already Bobby Baker was headed for jail, was LBJ next? Good thing for him he became president).

Kenneth Trentadue whose brother, Jesse Trentadue, is going through federal courts to force the facts out of the feds and in a serendipity manner he is also about to bust open all those "lost" and "unknown" DOJ documents surrounding the 1995 OKC bombing and nail the rest of the people involved.

[dajudem]

Kenneth Trentadue whose brother, Jesse Trentadue, is going through federal courts to force the facts out of the feds and in a serendipity manner he is also about to bust open all those "lost" and "unknown" DOJ documents surrounding the 1995 OKC bombing and nail the rest of the people involved.

Ah! Yes.. would that have been those 'middle-easterners' I have heard rumours about? McVeigh sure did the chair in a hurry I thought.

I have often wondered about spies too. I bet there are more spies in government now then ever were during the Cold War...

[TomasUSMC]

I worked for about three years with some Turks including almost a year in Ankara where I met many more. Mighty fine people.

---

Islam is the problem. There are plenty of good folks everywhere....

Turkey's Elected Islamists Fan EU Angst, Ire of Secular Leaders

Sheik Hafiz Kasim, with a gray, floor- length robe draped around his crossed legs, sits in front of about 100 worshippers at the Mevlevi sect's lodge in Urfa, Turkey, and prays for God to help Muslims oppressed by the U.S.

``Soviet Russia has collapsed,'' he explains after the service. ``God willing, the U.S. will disintegrate and crumble, too. The time is near.''

Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has allowed groups like Kasim's, banned since the creation of the Turkish republic in 1923, to resurface, feeding criticism from opposition leaders that he is moving the country of 70 million people toward Islamic rule. Erdogan, whose Islam-influenced party won a landslide victory in 2002, says he is merely promoting religious freedom.

``Turkish Islamists have secured the support of the U.S. and Western Europe to increase their power,'' says Bulut, who has written a dozen books on Islam. ``Islamists in Iraq, Syria, Saudi Arabia and other Middle Eastern countries also see Turkey as a model. When the right conditions prevail, all Islamists will revert to their original aim: To bring the rule of God.''

Erdogan, 51, leads the Justice and Development Party, founded by members of a party that was banned in 1998 because of its religious ties. The party garnered 66 percent of the seats in parliament in November 2002 elections, after winning support from Islamists and secular voters alienated by a government stalemate that had ballooned budget deficits and swelled inflation.

In May, the government eliminated jail sentences for people who set up illegal after-school programs to teach children about the Koran.

Erdogan on Nov. 15 criticized the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg, France, for upholding a ban on women wearing Islamic headscarves at Turkish universities.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

RE: "Islam is the problem."

Islamism is a problem and "Turkey's governing ideology -- Kemalism -- is not only secular, it bans all political expressions of Islam."

And from the article that appears to be the source for the article that you cited, "Turkish opposition leaders say Erdogan's efforts to loosen restrictions on religion threaten the country's secular state, founded by Kemal Ataturk in 1923."

http://quote.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000080&sid=aalmU5bWn18k

Also (another source), at least once after the election the Turkish army warned the new government about "anti-secular activities" and actions "aimed at eroding the republican traditions."

I firmly believe that the overwhelming majority of Turks would reject becoming a Muslim country and remain a country of Muslims (99.9+ percent). It is the Army's duty to protect their republican traditions.

Now on to some things that I believe are important background info but others may not or may disagree if anyone cares to read it.

Occasionally I find something in the news about Turkey that I follow such as their last election and our request to use their territory to enter Iraq.

The voters of Turkey demanded that the Justice and Development Party assure them that it was not Islamist. The voters were fed up with the old politics as usual crowd and its sinking economy. They wanted change. The voters accepted the Party's word and the Party won an absolute majority in Parliament.

The voters believed that Turkey's constitutional republic was safe -- and at least once after the election the Turkish army warned the new government about "anti-secular activities" and actions "aimed at eroding the republican traditions." It is the duty of the Army to protect the Republic. The last time it acted to do that was 1996 (97?) and I believe that it was against the Justice and Development Party's predecessor, the Virtue Party.

Erdogan, despite a 1998 conviction for Islamist sedition, did eventually become prime minister when the majority changed the law barring him.

I firmly believe that the overwhelming majority of Turks would reject becoming a Muslim country and remain a country of Muslims (99.9+ percent). We have decades of close friendship but they do not, understandably, like being taken for granted.

Some eighty percent of the population opposed letting the U.S. use their territory. Why? Josh Marshall's "Don't place blame on the Turks" in The Hill explains how it was a matter of nationalist priority and nothing to do with false allegations that the new government was "Islamist". "Turkey's governing ideology -- Kemalism -- is not only secular, it bans all political expressions of Islam."

http://www.hillnews.com/marshall/032603.aspx

To wit, take one priority. The Turkish desire to secure a PKK-free northern Iraqi Kurdistan. Washington refused to give that any priority until much latter, after the invasion.

The Erdogan government went to great lengths to get the Turkish parliament to approve the presence of U.S. troops on Turkish soil -- even in the face of almost universal public opposition. The Parliament came close but refused.

Why? Public opposition and I recall news reports at the time, France's warnings that Turkey would never get into the EU if they allowed the U.S. to use Turkish territory. The old political parties turned against us.

Though Washington wound up offering economic assistance it was portrayed in our press as Turkish "haggling" -- something that just angered the Turkish public and added to their objections which were based at least in part on the belief that Turkey's economic problems resulted from the Gulf War.

[TomasUSMC]

Thanks for the reply.

ArKadash

I still believe that the action denying the 4th ID trumps the political reasoning used to support that action

Semper Fi