I do not understand what you are saying. I looked up some sources and it is what I found:
Before Unia and transfer of eastern Ukraine from Polish into Russian rule, there was ONE metropolitan in the Russian/Ukrainian lands. He was residing in in Kiev and was the leader of the ONE church including today's Ukraine, Belarus, Russia (both Moscow and Novgorod regions).
As a result of Mongol invasions and destruction of Kiev the metropolitan moved to Vladimir - the city in north east (in Moscow region). It was still the ONE church. Later the territories of today's Belarus and Ukraine were conquered by Lithuanians and dominated by the Poles (who united with Lithuanians). Still both parts of the eastern Slavic church were one jurisdiction and not two. Only later when the Moscow grew as the leading power in eastern Rus she gained the independence from the Constantinople (became "auto-cephalous"). The Orthodox church under Polish rule was forcefully integrated into Roman Catholic Church while preserving her Byzantine rites. Is it what you mean by the TWO churches?
It came to be under Moscow's control in 1686. Up till 1589 Moscow was also subservient to Constantinople, and in effect it was on the same level as Kyiv, but then Russians declared independence from the Greeks.
I looked it up too. What happened in 1589 it was that the autocephaly of Moscow church was recognized by all Orthodox including Constantinople and the metropolitan of Moscow became a Patriarch (Patriarchs are the highest ranking bishops in Orthodox church, fully sovereign). But the actual autocephaly of the Russian Church derived from much earlier time - of the fall of Constantinople to the Muslim Turks and temporary sumbission of Patiarch of Constantinople to the Pope of Rome (original Unia of Florence). See some info on History of the Russian Church
Afterwords, the damn Pereyaslav in 1654, and in 1686 Kyiv Church came to be under Moscow
Would you expect that there would two separate jurisdictions kept divided by the future border line drawn by the Bolsheviks in XX century? BTW, this area in the east was the one which voted for Yanukovych and which is Russian speaking.
[A. Pole:]So the Church of Greece does not recognized "Ukr. Ortho. Church"? Why is that so?
[Mazepa:] Do you have to ask why? 'Cause Russia controls a fifth of the Earth's surface and Greeks aren't as brave as we'd like them to be.
I know several Greeks and they are not afraid of Russia, rather they appear to LIKE Russia very much!
"Something else I found "Of particular concern to the ROC is Constantinople Patriarch Bartholomew I's declaration in June that Ukraine lies within its canonical territory."
The source is some Ukrainian nationalist in Canada. Do you have an official source from Constantinople Patriarch Bartholomew about his claim?
[in your next post:]
Let's see- my mother is from Galicia and is a Greek Catholic. I've spent all my summer vacations in the village with my grandma, a Greek Catholic. You decide. :) BTW, my dad is Orthodox.
It is you who has to decide. Are you Catholic or are you Orthodox?
My general outlook on the Union- it was a negative in the 16, 17th, 18th centuries because it split the Ukrainians up, but in the 20th century - a huge positive.
Are the matters of church/faith secondary in relations to national issue? Is it the position of your friends?
You know, it is probable and expected that the 3 churches- UOC (Kyiv), Autocephalous and Greek Catholics would become one church in the future.
If this happen will this "united" church be Catholic or Orthodox? What is your preference? I understand that if the first then your church will not be a independent church - it will be a part of the Church of Rome.
I see that you again spreading Kremlin’s influence over whole Eastern Europe. I should treat it as a kind of perversion or maybe high treason? Do you really wish us to have common border with Soviet Union 2, I guess yes. What interest you have to support KGB Alexy, right hand of KGB Putin?
and you?
The move (some hundred years after the initial Mongol onslaught) of the metropolitan from Kyiv to Vladimir to Moscow is what substantiates the Russian claim to all of the former Rus'. A huge problem with that- Moscow was a Mongol puppet state. A more modern similarity- Nazis conquer France in 1940 and create a puppet, Vichy France, which claims the authority over all french territories. But there's also the Free French, hiding out somewhere in Senegal. Tell me who has the right to France and the French empire, the puppet or another region of French empire like Senegal?
Still both parts of the eastern Slavic church were one jurisdiction and not two.
No that's is incorrect. For example Halychyna, before AND after the Poles came, had their own metropolitan and was part of Constantinople jurisdiction not Moscow. I'm repeating myself- as Rus was destroyed its principalities became politically independent and isolated from each other, and so they created their own churches.
The Orthodox church under Polish rule was forcefully integrated into Roman Catholic Church while preserving her Byzantine rites.
No it wasn't, a PART of the Orthodox churches became Uniates but Orthodox Church existed in Poland-Lithuania. Sure, it was persecuted by the Catholic Poles but it remained strong. Ukrainian Cossacks, they weren't praying in the Moscow's church
Is it what you mean by the TWO churches?
No, that Ukrainian church and the Russian church were sister churches, part of the Byzantine jurisdiction; ==> Kyiv was not a part of Moscow.
What happened in 1589 it was that the autocephaly of Moscow church...
Then the Moscow church are schismatics,:)
Would you expect that there would two separate jurisdictions kept divided by the future border line drawn by the Bolsheviks in XX century?
My turn to not understand what is written. Bolsheviks defined borders of Ukraine? If that's what you meant then I'm in shock.
Here's an insight- Ukrainians existed before Bolshevics.
BTW, this area in the east was the one which voted for Yanukovych and which is Russian speaking.
You mean 'this area in the east was part of Moscow jurisdiction in 17th cent.'? Another insight- if there were priests present in the eastern and the southern Ukraine the only ones whom they would be able to preach to would be wolves and wild horses- the region was not populated (minus Slobodschyna).
The source is some Ukrainian nationalist in Canada. Do you have an official source from Constantinople Patriarch Bartholomew about his claim?
How convenient to discredit the source by calling him a nationalist in Canada. OK, I'll try to do better
http://www.risu.org.ua/eng/news/article;6059
Fifth story down the page.
Scroll down the page at this site
I know several Greeks and they are not afraid of Russia, rather they appear to LIKE Russia very much!
I support the opinion of this guy- Russians freaked out when Greeks supported Estonian church's independence from Moscow, imagine what Russia would do if Ukraine did the same, they'd go into coma. (Scroll down almost to the end of this site (Historical sidenote- Moscow took over Estonia's church when Soviets invaded in 1940, nice)
It is you who has to decide. Are you Catholic or are you Orthodox
What if I tell you there's no difference. Liturgy is identical, holidays are the same. BTW, in Ukrainian Orthodox Church Moscow Patriarchate liturgy is in Russian and is officially supported by the Communist Party of Ukraine, another Russian agent on the Ukrainian soil.
Are the matters of church/faith secondary in relations to national issue?
HAHAAHAHA- the naivette. Of course. Everything is political. I accuse Russians of the same- they use the church for nothing but politics.
Is it the position of your friends?
Hard question. I'm a city guy and most of my friends don't care that much which church to go to, so if there was an Ethiopian church nearby they'd go to that one. :)
If this happen will this "united" church be Catholic or Orthodox? What is your preference?
Orthodox.
Well one way to solve this sort of dilemma is to move to a tiny little town in the Mid West peopled by people of Scotish lineage who mostly attend the local Baptist Church!
That would be my grand dad ... :-)