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To: Campion; trebb; George W. Bush; NYer; Victoria Delsoul

"The only potentially open question concerns a man who has homosexual inclinations, but leads a chaste life. (And, as GWB points out, how do you necessarily even know who those men are?)"



I Corinthians 10:13 says "There is no temptation overtaken you but what is common...and God will provide the way of escape."

In other words, temptation to experiment with any number of self-gratifications and not just sexually is the norm. But temptation is not the indulging in the sin, any more than seeing a billboard or hearing a commercial on the radio constitutes my overt purchase of the product.


We are told to FLEE youthful lusts. (Paul writing to Timothy) and in Hebrews 12 we are told to 'make straight paths for your feet, so that the limb which is lame may not be put out of joint, but rather be healed.'


The issue is not who is tempted. The issue is turning to God and fleeing evil WHEN temptations of any kind flash through our mind...and avoiding walking into bathhouses if we have temptations toward homosexual acts, shunning buffets if we too often pig out and cutting up our credit cards if we too easily go into debt.


103 posted on 11/23/2005 8:37:29 AM PST by The Spirit Of Allegiance (SAVE THE BRAINFOREST! Boycott the RED Dead Tree Media & NUKE the DNC Class Action Temper Tantrum!)
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To: Blurblogger
In other words, temptation to experiment with any number of self-gratifications and not just sexually is the norm. But temptation is not the indulging in the sin, any more than seeing a billboard or hearing a commercial on the radio constitutes my overt purchase of the product.

Correct, however, not all men have a significant problem with homosexual temptation. And it's perfectly valid to set a higher standard for those to be ordained than for everyone else. At the very least, putting a man who has a significant temptation toward homosexual sin into a situation where he will be surrounded by other males 24/7 does not seem wise.

104 posted on 11/23/2005 8:41:20 AM PST by Campion ("I am so tired of you, liberal church in America" -- Mother Angelica, 1993)
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To: Blurblogger; NYer; Alberta's Child
"It's a clear statement by the Vatican that gay men are not welcome in seminaries and religious orders," said the Rev. James Martin...

"It raises the bar so high that it would be difficult to imagine gay men feeling encouraged to pursue a life in the priesthood," he added.

I agree with that.

The Vatican document emphasizes gays. That means, men whose homosexual tendencies are prevalent and as the Vatican document indicates, "who are actively homosexual, have deep-seated homosexual tendencies, or support the so-called 'gay culture.” If a gay man becomes a priest and keeps his homosexual tendencies and temptations under control, he wouldn't be called a “gay priest” but just a priest, because his homosexuality wouldn't override his commitment to priesthood, and no one would notice that at one point in his past he was homosexual.

However, in light of the many scandals the Catholic Church has faced regarding homosexual priests and the harm they've done to children, banning these individuals makes perfect sense not only to the Church and their communities, but also to the Church teachings.

God condemns homosexuality as described by Paul in Romans 1:

26:Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. 27:In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.


185 posted on 11/23/2005 7:34:05 PM PST by Victoria Delsoul
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