Pro-Gay-Marriage Jewish Leader called Not Jewish

Lifesite News ^ | 11/21/05 | Hilary White

[little jeremiah]

Homosexual Agenda Ping.

Universal moral absolutes are essentially the same in every monotheist religion in the world, and some that aren't. People who want to do what they want to do should start their own "religions", not pervert the ones based on revelation and scripture.

That's a double no-no. Be an advocate for immorality if you want, but do it under your own banner.

Freepmail me and DirtyHarryY2K if you want on/off this pinglist.

[little jeremiah]

If you have time (now or later), would you be able to explain the differences between Reform, Conservative, and Orthodox Judaism? Just so that we non-Jews have an idea. Thanks!

[darkangel82]

And what is the rule about arguments? The first to bring up Hitler loses.

Godwin's law.

[JewishRighter]

Your statement is correct. Most importantly, as you and others have pointed out, Yoffie may be practicing something, but it ain't judaism. I like to think of it as a devout form of liberalism.

[goldstategop]

Orthodox Jews think the Reform have simply made it easier for Jews to stray from their faith. There's an interesting debate in the book One People, Two Worlds between Orthodox Yosef Reinman and Reform Ammiel Hirsch. After reading it, there's little question who won the debate. When it comes to defending age-old Jewish values, the Reform are on the defensive.

(Denny Crane: "I Don't Want To Socialize With A Pinko Liberal Democrat Commie.Say What You Like About Republicans. We Stick To Our Convictions. Even When We Know We're Dead Wrong.")

[gidget7]

Jewish leader has no leg to stand with which to bash religious right!! As with all moral relativists, the truth is hate speech. And someone should tell the man, you can have bigoted opinions or views against a behavior! A race, a religion, yes, but not a behavior.

[goldstategop]

Now secular Jews don't necessarily always keep kosher bur the least they can do is abstain from eating pork and shellfish as a matter of habit. At least make an effort to try to follow God's laws even if its hard for you. Its for your moral well-being.

(Denny Crane: "I Don't Want To Socialize With A Pinko Liberal Democrat Commie.Say What You Like About Republicans. We Stick To Our Convictions. Even When We Know We're Dead Wrong.")

[gidget7]

"Deformed" Jews are NOT real Jews. Don't be fooled, my Christian friends."


I love it!!! What a great tagline!

[JewishRighter]

Please explain in some detail what you mean when you say the Rabbi kept the Sabbath and kosher. I have some good friends who re-converted to Judaism when they realized that the Reform conversion practice, administered by Rabbis who reject the most fundamental tenets of the Torah, is problematic, at best.

A Jew is correctly defined as someone born of a Jewish mother or a person who converts to Judaism halachically-meaning in strict accordance with the laws and regulations of the Torah. It is admirable and proper for all Jews (and all good people of conscience and decency) to stand together. But we have to be very accurate and careful in defining authentic Judaism and Jews since thousands of years of heritage is riding on it.

You sound like a very sincere person and I strongly encourage you to look up an Orthodox Rabbi in your area to discuss your status. There is so much more for you to gain from your strong Jewish drive when you are introduced to true Torah Judaism.

I wish you well.

[goldstategop]

The Reform have confused Judaism with liberal philosophy. The two are NOT the same. Reform was supposed to be an updating of Judaism to fit the needs of modern life. It seems they updated the Reform part but dropped the Judaism by the roadside. For people who don't care about Jewish tradition, its hard to sit there and hear them lecture about how evil its to hate homosexuals. I read the Torah and quite frankly, I don't see it at all there the way Yoffie does.

(Denny Crane: "I Don't Want To Socialize With A Pinko Liberal Democrat Commie.Say What You Like About Republicans. We Stick To Our Convictions. Even When We Know We're Dead Wrong.")

[Cinnamon Girl]

Reformism is not Judaism.

[goldstategop]

Its probably a good idea for him to study under an Orthodox Rabbi. I don't question his conversion or Jewishness even if the conversion is halachically problematic. However, like a lot of converts who have come to Judaism via Reform, he finds that its not spiritually satisfying enough. So they find themselves seeking true Judasm and become authentic Jews. And they're probably better Jews than many born Jews too disaffected or apathetic to devote themselves to understanding the faith they were born into. The Torah is immutable and cannot be changed by Man. God's decree is timeless even if human interpretations about what it means err.

(Denny Crane: "I Don't Want To Socialize With A Pinko Liberal Democrat Commie.Say What You Like About Republicans. We Stick To Our Convictions. Even When We Know We're Dead Wrong.")

[fish hawk]

Gee that's nice. I know a lot of "Christians" that go to church on Sunday and try to help the poor etc. etc. They just have never accepted the Christ as their savior. Therefore, no matter what they think they are, they are not Christians in the real sense. Possibly this fits you in your religion???

[JewishRighter]

If you don't mind my stepping in here, I'll offer a brief explanation:

Orthodox judaism maintains that the Torah, including both the written bible and other scriptures as well as the oral traditions, including the Talmud and legal codes, are divine in origin (ie: given at Sinai). Orthodox Jews today maintain strict adherence to all Torah commandments and Rabbinic directives. These include observance of the Sabbath, Holy Days, Kosher, personal moral restraint, and many other laws governing daily life.

Conservative Judaism accepts the written Torah as divine, but does not accept the oral law as such. Therefore Conservative Judaism has substantially relaxed and/or abandonded observance of many aspects of day-to-day Jewish observance. They still try to adhere to some of the basics of Sabbath and Holy Day observance and are more likely to try to maintain some kosher observance.

Reform Judaism does not accept the Torah as divine in any respect. I would even go so far as to ask just what the current reform concept of G-d is or if they actually believe in G-d as the creator of the world or just that there is some spiritual force. As I commented elsewhere, you are more likely to find that Reform Judaism seems to be religious liberalism. There is virtually no observance of Jewish ritual in any traditional sense.

As you may have guessed, I am Orthodox. I do not mean to demean other Jews at all. Orthodox Judaism teaches us to love all Jews regardless of affiliation. However, we must be candid about distinguishing what is Judaism and what has become something else. I often hear that my less religious brothers and sisters think that Orthodox Jews don't consider conservative and reform Jews to be Jews. That is not true at all. They are Jews if born of a Jewish mother or if converted to Judaism in accordance with Torah law. What is said is they may not be observing Judaism. They are still Jews regardless.

I hope this very rudimentary explanation helps.

[JewishRighter]

Well said. We might not agree exactly about the question of the conversion, but the rest of what you say is right on.

[little jeremiah]

I appreciate your explanation. I grew up around a lot of Jews, many of whom did not practice any Judaism at all that I could see.

I also consider that all people, regardless of religious denomination, sect, or religious persuasion, should see our agreements and focus on that which is destroying the world - aggressive atheism, secularism, and moral "relativism" (leaving aside for the purposes of this disucssion Islam).

Anyone who believes in God and the moral absolutes which are universal is on the side of light.

Little question - are vegetarians automatically following kosher, since they eat no meat? Vegetarians who eat no animal flesh of any kind?

[Alouette]

are vegetarians automatically following kosher, since they eat no meat? Vegetarians who eat no animal flesh of any kind?

A completely vegan diet is completely kosher. Dairy products have to come from a kosher animal, although it is extremely rare in this country to find milk from a non-kosher animal.

[Alter Kaker]

"Deformed" Jews are NOT real Jews.

Yes they are.

[little jeremiah]

What would milk from a non-kosher animal be? You mean like pig milk (ACK!), or a cow which is not maintained in a certain manner?