Posted on 11/20/2005 5:33:06 AM PST by Alas Babylon!
The Talk Shows
Sunday, November 20th, 2005
Guests to be interviewed today on major television talk shows:
FOX NEWS SUNDAY (Fox Network): Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld; Sen. Joseph Biden, D-Del.
MEET THE PRESS (NBC): Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa.; Health and Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt; Dr. Julie Gerberding, director, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention; Dr. Anthony S. Fauci, director, National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases; Dr. Mike Ryan, director, Epidemic and Pandemic Alert and Response Department of the World Health Organization.
FACE THE NATION (CBS): Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld; Sens. Richard Lugar, R-Ind., and Chris Dodd, D-Conn.
THIS WEEK (ABC): Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld.
LATE EDITION (CNN) : Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld.
Exactly! You get it.
And we cannot let OUR politicians be a part of that. YOu saw the paragraph Ollie wrote about how one of our own guys voted with the left, although he admitted he disagreed with the left. That just left me completely perplexed.
As another freeper on another thread called it, I think it's a case of Democrat Lookalitis. The Pubbies WANT to be liked and popular and invited on the shows.
Instead, they should hold a major press conference with charts and sound bites in prime time that the press is REQUIRED to cover.
Johnnie, I appreciate your committment and your unflagging efforts. However, you have fallen into the trap of believing that the reality of things as perceived by FReepers corresponds to the reality of things as perceived by the rest of the country, and most importantly, as perceived by our troops who are laying their lives on the line.
Everyone here is aware that the polls are flawed, and deliberately skewed. Unfortunately, that fact is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is whether people are beginning to believe them, and most importantly, whether our troops are beginning to believe them. The evidence clearly indicates that this is happening, and it is affecting troop morale.
You have steadfastly refused to acknowledge this, and have lashed out at fellow FReepers who I know are just as committed as you are to our nation's success in fighting our common enemy. As I see it the issue boils down to, after all the sturm und drang, that 1. the polls are wrong and should be ignored (you), and 2. the polls are wrong, but are nevertheless having a negative effect and should be countered by the President (them).
The crucial question is "What are the logical consequences of following your course versus following theirs?
Scenario 1 - the President acts to counter the lies. If you're correct, the result is positive. If you're wrong, the result is still positive.
Scenario 2 - the President fails to act. If you're correct, the result is still positive. However, if they're correct, the result is a negative.
By logic, failure of the President to act entails a risk of a negative outcome, while Presidential action results in positive effects regardless of who is "correct". Therefore, logically, action by the President is the correct response.
BTW, this is exactly the same logical argument which demontrated why we had to remove Saddam Hussein.
You probably saw my post waaay upthread that talks about how darned few congresscritters even reviewed the pre war intelligence.
So how can they make a considered judgement that the intelligence was manipulated?
Sorry I jumped you Man. You are right. I lost my cool because of the heat of the battle today. I disagree with you on Rummy but you have every right to say what you think. It's what we are all here for.
What good would it do to manipulate Intelligence you never read anyway (insert name of favorite Senator/Congressperson/Dem Candidate here)
LOL---maybe we should ask Bush 41...wasn't he CIA Director???
HAHAHA! Made it to 1000! Means you have to go to 1500 next time you judge. Ok, going to write it all up.
From Ollie North
snip
But recent reversals -- not on the battlefield but in Washington -- have caused nearly all of those I talked to on this trip to question whether we are suddenly in danger of losing the war they have been fighting.
This sudden loss of assurance in our fighting forces has nothing to do with casualty figures, troop levels, the leaders prosecuting the war in the field or new acts of terror by a ruthless enemy. Rather, the anxieties I'm now hearing from those I have covered in combat come in questions like: "Do you think that they are going to pull us out before we've finished the mission?" and "Will we abandon Iraq like we abandoned Vietnam?" Interestingly, not one of the thousands of young Americans I have covered in Iraq or Afghanistan has ever asked about or commented upon pre-war intelligence.
snip
They need assurance that the @!#$%^ spineless posturing Congress is going to stand up and support the mission.
No problem FRiend...
And I could be dead wrong about Rummy as it would only encourage our enemies (foreign and domestic)...
And I do believe that things are going better there militarily regarding the border...
Sometimes I just "blurt out stuff" with very little thought.
I have a feeling Shakespeare couldn't get a message through this MSM....they have been after Bush since 2000, just like the dems...
There is NO WAY that speaking well will turn this around...he needs to just do what he does best...speak the truth.
Who said they were questioning their mission? I haven't seen anyone say that on this thread.
And who said anything about discipline breaking down? You are just making stuff up now and trying to change what HAS been said.
Which is that Ollie North was on a radio show and talked about the low morale. This was stated in a post directly to you by another freeper who heard the radio show.
You have been told by a few freepers now that morale is low among the troops and we know this because we know the soldiers because they are in our families.
Nice try at restating what has been said by Ollie North which is as follows:
I'm hearing something different -- a loss of confidence in the final outcome. (from the soldiers)
But recent reversals -- not on the battlefield but in Washington -- have caused nearly all of those I talked to on this trip to question whether we are suddenly in danger of losing the war they have been fighting.
The measure was defeated 58 to 40, but an amended version, setting 2006 as a "period of significant transition creating conditions for the phased redeployment of United States forces from Iraq," passed by an overwhelming 79-19 margin. (Outrageously wimpy of our Republicans).
the message to the troops is clear: No matter where we stand in the war on terror -- if the Senate has its way, we're "pulling out" in 2006.
Major General William Webster, commanding the U.S. Army's 3rd Infantry Division in Iraq said that "setting a date would mean that the 221 soldiers I've lost this year, that their lives will have been lost in vain." A U.S. Marine colonel, recently returned from Iraq, called it "a formula for disaster." And universally those I have met with here in Hawaii, from the U.S. Army's 25th Infantry Division to the 1st Marine Brigade, to the sailors of the fleet, to the wounded at Tripler Army Hospital -- all expressed anger and frustration
That's a valid question. Even Senate Republicans don't seem to know what they want. As the "World's Greatest Deliberative Body" was exploring how to set a "date certain" for withdrawing troops without setting a certain date, Sen. John Cornyn, R-Texas, said, "Americans do not cut and run, Americans do not abandon their commitments and Americans do not abandon their friends." But he voted for the measure anyway.
The GOP leadership, senior administration officials and the president need to dramatically alter the debate. They need to go to Iraq -- talk to the troops and reassure them that we will stay there long enough to get the job done and not one second longer. Notwithstanding the "peace in our time" appeasement sentiment sweeping through our capital, it's not too late. Republicans need to realize that wining the war in Iraq is the only issue that really matters right now. It is more important than Medicare, the next Supreme Court justice, foreign trade deals or tax reform. If we lose the war -- and we could -- none of these things will matter.
That just makes my blood boil.
The Dems must pay a price for this...
If this is truly "Vietnam all over again", it is only because the same group of traitors with their media cohorts are seeking to undermine our fighting men and women.
Beautifully stated.
When I say require, I would think that you would understand that when 50-60 members of Congress get together with charts and soundbites and a well planned press conference, even the leftist media will air it.
And the public will hear it.
And Congress should write more letters countering the lies too. I've seen a few and they are great and the press does print them. Even the leftist press.
You are right, there is a big difference in thinking that some Fair Weather Rinos and left wing nut dems don't have your back. That is damned depressing, but those Guys and Gals over there and just coming back or soon to be leaving know that the President will always have their back, and so will most Americans. I asked my older Brother if he was going to be with the Cowardly thinking creeps that are undermining our Military and he looked like I had punched him. Reality check for him, he was the first Pubbie in our Family, and it was contrary to all his previous thinking.
I don't want to know what kind of bird you have in mind for Tim.
Your name Babylon, reminds me....the book "One Bullet Away" that was reviewed today on c-spann by the marine captain...he is a history buff and right after the fall of Baghdad he got permission to go to Babylon. He invited his marines (voluntary....any who wanted to go) to go with him. He said it was around a 100 mile drive that they would not be able to do today.....but when they got there, an old Iraqi man came up to him and said "call me Ishmael"! lol
It was really his name and he was very knowledgeable about the ancient history and gave them an all day tour!
I did not reference this article, nor claim the things outlined above. I referenced the emails I received from Iraq from two freinds serving over there, why do you keep posting your rebuttals for the article to me??
I kept off TV until the Zarqawi possible death was reported this afternoon..I am just so angry. I did not want to listen to Murtha or Biden..or Juan..or Ci Ci or anyone who would get my BP up higher.
I SUPPORT OUR TROOPS AND THEIR MISSION!
Here is where I have a different take than you...
Even if President Bush had a Prime time press conference every week...even though the 3 big channels would NOT cover them...in order to get decent questions, he would have to "stack" the questioners...which would be sniffed out immediately...
I watch every presser..and all he gets are "when are you going to apologize"...6 times..."when are you going to be honest about the pre-war intelligence"...5 times....."why hasn't the WMDs been found"...a few times...
"why can't you get the international community involved"...oh, and now..."what did you know, and when did you know it about Valerie Plame"...10 times...
IOWS...most often as not...he won't get to answer the questions he will be mocked, basically.
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