Posted on 11/11/2005 4:29:40 PM PST by blam
Bird flu may over-stimulate immune system
HONG KONG, Nov. 11 (UPI) -- Researchers in Hong Kong say the H5N1 bird flu virus may provoke an excessive immune reaction, explaining why it is deadly even to the young and healthy.
Laboratory tests on human cells showed that the virus caused the immune system to send proteins called cytokines to infected lung cells, a reaction that would end up damaging or destroying the tissues the immune system is meant to defend.
The tests were carried out by scientists at the University of Hong Kong, working with samples from patients who died in Vietnam. The results were published in the online medical journal Respiratory Research.
The research suggested that patients who contract bird flu may need drugs that suppress the immune response in addition to anti-viral drugs like Tamiflu. It also indicated that healthy people with strong immune systems could fare worse than others if they became infected.
The virus has killed flocks of poultry and migratory birds, particularly in Asia, in recent months, but only 124 people have been infected, through direct contact with birds. Sixty-four of them have died.
The new research may affect preparations by health officials worldwide, who fear a pandemic may occur if the virus mutates to become passed from human to human.
Copyright 2005 by United Press International. All Rights Reserved.
I don't know what's correct here.
I don't disagree about the size proper of the virus particle. However, in practice the virus particle is not isolated -- it is surrounded by fluid, etc., and the whole package is well within the range effectively filtered by N95. I think people are well served by purchasing N95 products. I myself own a couple of cartons of N95 as well as p100 respirator cartridges. Regarding masks, I think fit is a much greater issue than filtration level (I am talking about a potential 1/8" gap versus this micron stuff!).
It is mainly the nanomask people who have been spinning this in an attempt to sell their own filtration products. However, the worldwide medical community doesn't seem to be either impressed with the nanomask claims or dissuaded from the use of N95 against either SARS or influenza.
This is from Flu Wiki:
The N95 masks are rated to stop 95% of the particles .3 microns or larger. Most virus is .15 micron or smaller. The question has been raised at a number of forums as to whether N95 masks will reduce the risk of influenza infection during a pandemic. One issue that has been brought up is the size of viruses, which are often smaller than 0.3 microns, the size of particle N95 masks are rated to exclude. Both the SARS coronavirus and influenza viruses are considerably smaller than this. So why would an N95 mask work? The reason is that viruses may spread from person to person attached to droplets or other particles that are much larger then 0.3 microns. Empirical data supports this contention. During the SARS outbreak, N95 masks were shown to decrease the incidence of SARS infection among nurses in Singapore and Toronto with respect to nurses who did not wear such masks. Reference
Of course, an N95 mask is not a guarantee against infection. It is rated to protect against 95% of particles, which obviously means 5% can still get in. N99 and N100 masks offer a higher levels of protection.
http://www.fluwikie.com/index.php?n=Forum.MasksN95AndOthers
Yes, NAC is in my kit, too.
I recommend everyone watch it. I'm not as prepared as I thought.
I'm 62 years old, have no medical problems, retired, single and plan to deal with any pandemic by isolating.
I just found out about that a minute ago on current events. Hope it's repeated.
Yes, the Black Flu of 1918 did exactly the same thing. Those that died in our family were in their early twenties, one a brand-new bride.
Looks like it will be repeated in 4 hours.
Thanks for the info. I have N95 masks.
"What sort of cartridges?"
I don't know but there was a lively discussion about .40 versus .45 here recently.
Just book marking :)
I work every day on my bug-out truck (plumbing, heating, cooling, cooking, medical supplies, etc.). However, with a family of four, and three pet birds, it will be a little cramped.
When we used to sell spice the packages (from India) didn't have the "r" in the first syllable. Oddly, there seem to be many more spellings as "turmeric" on the Internet.
And many of the deaths will be from dehydration, not suffocation. If you get past the first couple days, as will most of us old farts without pre-existing serious conditions, then if you are too weak in body and will (this flu gets both, big time) then you will die for lack of water unless someone else is keeping you in fluids for a few days. The fever will evaporate water from your rapidly fading carcass faster than just about anything you've done since the vigorous athletics of your youth.
Watch it. It is the most current program I've seen, they do a lot of 'What If's' and don't hold anything back, some potential bleak situations and possibilities are examined and discussed.
It's so current that they even talk about the $7.1 billion that Bush has committed to the effort. Michael Leavitt said that he thought everyone had been sufficently warned and should be prepared, I disagree with that.
Anyone have any advice on how to manage (medically) my four dogs during a pandemic?
I agree. I think it is a bit dangerous to keep taking Elderberry if you get infected.
Judith Anne, at issue is whether the increase in cytokine production from Elderberry is greater or less than the reduction of the virus. My guess is that it would cause more net cytokine production (i.e. the derivative of cytokine production >> derivative of virus reduction). Moreover, since there are alternatives, it seems that to continue to take Elderberry would be quite dangerous.
My specific plans are to take Elderberry (Sambucol), Cinnamon (for blood sugar control anyway), and Resveratrol (it is a nice anti-oxidant) prior to infection as a prophylactic. Then, if I get infected, to DROP the Sambucol and add Garlic, Green Tea, and Turmeric. I would also add Tamiflu if I can get it.
Of course, the real problem will be to get my kids to go along with this. Alas.
Just today I was thinking about hanging a a water supply from the ceiling, with a flexible hose, to make it as easy to drink as possible. I know, I'm way out in left field.
"Ahem, grape juice works just as well, I've read."
Spoil Sport!
I can do that.
I plan not to have a dehydration problem by not getting the virus. I have one son (Dr. blam, physics) who lives in L.A. and I can't get him interested in preparations. He'll probably come home when TSHTF.
If this one lasts a couple winters, in month or two long waves, you won't have enough tamiflu, unless you are able to afford far more than most of us. There just isn't enough to go around. Best to learn about the Tamiflu/Relenza alternatives while they are in ready supply.
And that amantadine won't do you a damn bit of good. From www.washingtonpost.com:
Bird Flu Drug Rendered Useless
Chinese Chickens Given Medication Made for Humans
By Alan Sipress Washington Post Foreign Service Saturday, June 18, 2005; Page A01
HONG KONG -- Chinese farmers, acting with the approval and encouragement of government officials, have tried to suppress major bird flu outbreaks among chickens with an antiviral drug meant for humans, animal health experts said. International researchers now conclude that this is why the drug will no longer protect people in case of a worldwide bird flu epidemic.
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