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To: Icelander

I agree with many parts of your post .. but 1) I cannot support the building of a wall. Historically walls/fences have all failed in the long term. Partial list off the top of my head .. Hadrian's Wall, Great Wall of China, Maginot Line, medieval castles, Berlin wall ..walls of the past are tourist attractions of today .. How many countries of today are walled off? .. yet history is full of leaders building walls. Can we be sure that "modern high tech walls" will be any different?

Proverbs 17:19
He who loves a quarrel loves sin; he who builds a high gate invites destruction.


Surely there are ways to keep out those who wish to leech the system without imprisoning oneself?

2) Illegal aliens who don't want to leech the system and have proven it shouldnt be deported. Although they broke the law to get here, but if they love the United States and genuinely make amends the crime should be forgiven. Why be cruel to those who are genuinely sorry and making contributions to the country? Even though deporting them would "send a message", so would secure borders and a system that doesnt offer social welfare to those who don't contribute. The Bible says that God loves the alien (Deuteronomy 10:17, Zechariah 7:10, Leviticus 19:10, Ezekiel 22:29 Deuteronomy 24:14 ..etc).


3 posted on 11/10/2005 7:38:33 PM PST by catchphrase (Better a little with righteousness, than a lot with injustice. Proverbs 16:8)
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To: catchphrase

see # 4


5 posted on 11/10/2005 7:50:44 PM PST by HuntsvilleTxVeteran (I shot an error into the air. It's still going everywhere. R. A. HEINLEIN)
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To: catchphrase

I bet France wishes that they built a wall


6 posted on 11/10/2005 8:34:36 PM PST by Wolfhound777 (It's not our job to forgive them. Only God can do that. Our job is to arrange the meeting)
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To: catchphrase

It also says in the bible quoting Jesus, , the most important commandments is to love God with all your heart mind and strength and the second commandment is to love your neighbor as yourself. If there is no respect for authority, but we offer charity instead, then we are putting the 2nd commandment in front of the 1st.


10 posted on 11/10/2005 10:49:58 PM PST by seastay
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To: catchphrase
Illegal aliens who don't want to leech the system and have proven it shouldnt be deported.

Huh? Just forgive them for breaking our laws for years? Sure, if you want to set that precedent then be prepared to let all the con men, swindler, embezzelers, rapists, etc. go free. If you forgive one crime why not all?

Although they broke the law to get here, but if they love the United States and genuinely make amends the crime should be forgiven.

How do you prove you 'love the United States'? Make them swear on the Bible? If they've been lying for years why would they tell the truth now?

Why be cruel to those who are genuinely sorry and making contributions to the country?

Again, how does one prove they are genuinely sorry? How does someone who is here illegally, leeching off of our system contribute?

By the way, I don't recall us adopting the Bible for our laws. Why do you keep quoting the Bible in regards to illegals?

12 posted on 11/11/2005 8:50:30 AM PST by raybbr
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To: catchphrase
Illegal aliens who don't want to leech the system and have proven it shouldnt be deported. Although they broke the law to get here, but if they love the United States and genuinely make amends the crime should be forgiven. Why be cruel to those who are genuinely sorry and making contributions to the country?

Do you feel the same way about American lawbreakers? If an American commits a misdemeanor, but that American loves the United States and genuinely makes amends, should their crime be forgiven? I mean, why be cruel to those who are genuinely sorry and are making contributions to this country?

13 posted on 11/11/2005 9:00:55 AM PST by judgeandjury
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To: catchphrase

I disagree with everything that you have posted.

Other's posts above mine give some of the reasons.

Isn't one of the Commandments, "Thou Shall not Steal"?

These criminals stole their way into my country, steal their way north to an illegal job provided by a criminal and then further steal from me by not paying their way, IE, hospital bills, prison space and welfare, Etc.

You are wrong and quoting the Bible doesn't change a single thing.


14 posted on 11/11/2005 9:17:50 AM PST by Eaker (My Wife Rocks! - I will never take Dix off of my ping list as I have been asked to do.)
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To: catchphrase
Funny how you quote Proverbs 17, a chapter which contrasts individuals' behaviors: it is pointing to the difference between those whose behavior is upright and those who are wicked; this has NOTHING to do with ALLOWING a person to act as a CRIMINAL, to ALLOW a person to break a country's legal and legitimate laws because he takes issue with those laws (which are not immoral laws). Those with an upright character follow and obey laws; the wicked do not, rather, they seek selfish gain. Illegal aliens are breaking American laws for selfish gain. God does not condone criminal behavior. It is disingenuous of you to suggest otherwise.

Luke 20:21 And they asked Him, saying, Master, we know that thou sayest and teachest rightly, neither acceptest thou the person of any, but teachest the way of God truly:

22 Is it lawful for us to give tribute unto Caesar, or no?

23 But He perceived their craftiness, and said unto them, Why tempt ye me?

24 Shew me a penny. Whose image and superscription hath it? They answered and said, Caesar's.

25 And He said unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which be Caesar's, and unto God the things which be God's.

The Bible says that God loves the alien (Deuteronomy 10:17, Zechariah 7:10, Leviticus 19:10, Ezekiel 22:29 Deuteronomy 24:14 ..etc).

Again, you wrongly use the Scriptures to twist God's meaning and intent.

When Jesus said, "render to Caesar what is Caesar's," He wasn't just talking about taxes; He wanted to make sure that His followers understood they are to follow and obey the laws of the land under which they are subject....this theme is throughout ALL the Scriptures. The only time there is a suggestion that man's law may not be followed is when it clearly goes against God's moral laws. And since you freely quote the Scriptures, I'm sure you know there are countless instances where the Prophets, Jesus, and His Disciples forbid God's followers from breaking a country's laws, committing crimes for personal gain, encouraging others to commit crimes, or making excuses for lawbreakers.

Even the devil knows Scripture and quoted them to Christ:

Then the devil took him to the holy city and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down. For it is written:

'He will command his angels concerning you, and they will lift you up in their hands, so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'
Jesus answered him, "It is also written: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'" — Matthew 4:5-7

21 posted on 11/11/2005 10:45:00 AM PST by nicmarlo
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