Posted on 11/09/2005 7:48:11 PM PST by Wiz
Bangkok, 9 Nov. (AKI) - As the violence in Thailand's hree southernmost provinces shows no sign of abating, prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra has announced an impending “D-Day” against the rebels. In the last 24 hours, Muslim insurgents have attacked Yala Provincial Hall and a series of other minor targets, while Bangkok has announced the killing of Hasueming Jarong, a leading member of the Pattani Mujahideen, one of the groups fighting for an independent Islamic state comprising Yala, Narathiwat and Pattani.
Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra said that the government has prepared a large scale offensive against the rebels to be launched in the next couple of days. “We will launch a D-Day to solve problems in the southernmost provinces. All measures have already been planned. We will no longer be on the defensive,'' he said on Tuesday night.
A source said the so-called D-Day operation in the 'Deep South', as the three provinces are collectively known, would be launched after 9 November. He did not elaborate.
However, to residents of the three mostly Muslim provinces - where the scale of violence and the boldness of the attacks have increased steadily since the first outbreak on January 4, 2004 - the prime minister's words may provide little comfort.
(Excerpt) Read more at adnki.com ...
A number of the 'militants' have been caught with large amounts of Malaysian currency. The Malaysian government has pledged support to Thailand but it has been purely symbolic at this point. They have not been cooperating at all with the Thai police/military. That is all I can really say right now.
The only thing they've lost control of in that time is Vatcherin, which forced the princely family to return to Thailand proper.
Now about the indigenous people who were there when the Chinese first arrived ~ times were tough.
After that time, of course, there were only Han Chinese. The "barbarians" to the North (I believe they were called the Hakka) had not yet gotten strong enough to effectively challenge the Han on a permanent basis.
Circa 1600 years ago people in what is now Southern China colonized Thailand. Circa 1500 years ago people in what is now Northeastern China/Korea (including the hard pressed Hakka) colonized Japan (expressing themselves now as 60% of the gene pool). Then the Dark Ages fell on Europe and China, and it was 300 more years before the Chinese were able to "expand". Fortunately that gets us into an era where Chinese record keeping was sufficient to inform us of just about everything that happened (more or less), and it was just one damned thing after another!
In the 15th Century, however, the Han Chinese established a naval port on Penang (many sources say Malacca, but the site was the "Five Sided Land" (if I'm translating the Sanskrit correctly).
Obviously the Chinese government did not conquer Thailand, nor did the Emperor ever extend his rule to any appreciable sector of the place, but the Ming Emperor could send Admiral He right to the heart of the approaches to Thailand and do what he wished.
Concerning the cultural differences, it's pretty clear that Southern Buddhist areas are different from Northern Buddhist areas. For one thing, they use different numbers of the sacred, but otherwise agreed upon, texts. Everybody gets to be a monk, too, and get that overwith before adulthood.
Then came WWII and many Chinese fled South. Then came the Commies and even more Chinese fled South. Everybody didn't go to Taiwan or Hong Kong. A gazillion of these guys joined the existing community of Overseas Chinese in Thailand. In the end, Thailand had three different but important populations of Chinese origin. First were the immigrants from Classical Times. Second were the people who migrated/immigrated to the region from Admiral He's day down to the late 1800s. Third were the people who fled (for a variety of reasons) the breakdown and reconstruction of Chinese forms of government (from the Warlords to Wal-Mart).
I know there are Thai people who refuse to believe any Chinese ever came to Thailand. Then there are Thai people who have a grandparent, greatgrandparent, or paid attention in history class who KNOW they have an ancestor who actually came from China.
Ain't no thang!
I presume the folks who were smart enough to bury the stone Buddhaheads and incense bowls will be smart enough and dig them out so that when the army comes to their house, they can pretend to be Buddhist.
Those who are not smart will probably not survive.
BTW, I'm happy to hear you think Thailand is homogenized and all the various groups assimilated into the larger national polity. Keep that thought in mind.
That's probably coincidental if any 5 tone language could be considered so. On the other hand, I've found the best way to introduce Thai people to American food is to take them to a taco/burrito joint! They recognize it instantly.
Oh, and the Austronesian thing ropes in Japanese as well.
Unfortunately there are no extant Austronesian languages widely spoken, but we know they existed due to the loans they made of vocabulary, idiom and grammar to other languages.
As far as anyone having "civilization" in Thailand 4000 years ago, that comes before the critical 1875BC "cut off date" for a really nasty event in world history that physically destroyed civilizations East of Egypt. Whoever they were, the Chinese who came down from China later on had few problems with them.
Concerning the Malaysia government, it's basically a dictatorship. Nothing goes on the ruling council doesn't know about. The Thai government would be well advised to eliminate them as soon as possible.
I'll have to research the Central Mexico - Thai connection.
Here's a nice timeline of ancient southeast asia:
http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/ht/02/sse/ht02sse.htm
You have a great country. Thanks for being here!
Umm... There is/are a large Chinese population in Thailand. Nobody has ever denied that. My comments were on the origin of the Thai people and Tai language which is certainly different than 'Chinese'. I am not sure what point you are trying to arrive at.
What happened in 1875BC?
I have events recorded in the tree rings around 2200BC and 1628BC.
Remember, English, for example, has "tone" only on entire phrases. Chinee and Thai have "tone" on individual syllables. Still, there is no doubt that speakers of the various Chinese languages think of Thai as being different since it has 5 instead of 4 tones. There are similar languages in Mexico.
So, what happened in 1875 BC? It was something big. Dendochronological techniques are only going to reflect things that affect the average climate in discrete areas. A really big meteor shower that set massive fires would probably not affect the climate but it'd sure cause some serious problems for people.
So, you think we had a meteor shower in 1875BC? (...And, it didn't affect things worldwide)
Chicago and Wisconsin had fires, but most of the rest of the world didn't.
Sorry, but the two languages are incredibly different. I can speak both Thai and Mandarin. Yes, the languages both have tones, but the tones are quite different. The grammar is also completely different with almost no simularity at all. I am not a linguist, but they probably have as much in common as English and Hebrew. Trust me, I knew Mandarin first and switching over to Thai has caused me a world of grief.
What you are running into is the Austronesian component in the language. Drives people nuts learning Japanese too. I hate the part about counting things, animals and people differently. This has hindered my ability to learn much Japanese language.
I know at this time, the people in the Tarim Basin were crowded around the glacier fed streams and when the glaciers completely melted away, the rivers dried up and they moved too.
The Hakka made five migrations across China, north to south. Many had Caucasian features when they left and were slaughtered during these migrations across China. To this day, they are known as 'the guests.'
My local Chinese restaurant owner was shocked when I said, "you're Hakka, aren't you?" He was.
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