[RogueIsland]

To the contrary, both snowflakes and crystals require space/time, physical laws and physical causation. At the very least, these are guides to the system.

And this applies to Evolution as well, which is the subject of the thread. I'm not sure why on every Evolution thread you want to deflect the discussion to some esoteric ruminiation on the origin of the universe, when there are occasional cosmology threads for that. I can only assume that the handful of IDers who have actually taken the time to form an intelligent and studied opinion on the matter, such as yourself, have concluded that they must retreat that far back to hold the line on ID given its utter lack of empirical or observational success in the rather more immediate sphere of speciation.

[js1138]

It's really very simple. It gives a gloss of respectability to the argument and it eliminates the need for demonstrating any empirical results. When you get to ruminate about additional spacetime dimensions without providing any actual calculations that can be tested and verified, you can say anything.

[Alamo-Girl]

Thank you for sharing your views!

I'm not sure why on every Evolution thread you want to deflect the discussion to some esoteric ruminiation on the origin of the universe, when there are occasional cosmology threads for that.

It does seem that many of the debates come down to a difference in worldviews usually centering around "what is reality?" When we arrive at the point where each side has taken opposite views in the Aristotle v Plato paradigm (math) - then we can usually end the debate in mutual respect, because people of good conscience can disagree.

However, it is inappropriate to view biology as autonomous among the sciences. At the root - all of biological life must obey the physical laws, rocks and rabbits are comprised of the same geometry and energy/matter.

Cosmology and mathematics inform astronomy, physics and quantum mechanics. They inform biology as well.