[Alamo-Girl]

Thank you both for your replies!

But, er, both are you have deferred to Amos' wording and not my own. Would you please redirect and refute my summation of his point, namely:

Order cannot rise out of chaos in an unguided physical system.

That statement I aver is unequivocal.

In the alternative, if you wish to tackle Amos' wording we need to agree on a model for measuring complexity. Alternatives are listed at post 205 under item #3.

[Right Wing Professor]

Order cannot rise out of chaos in an unguided physical system.

Snowflakes are physical systems. Crystals are physical systems. They arise from purely disordered precursors.

[MHalblaub]

"Order cannot rise out of chaos in an unguided physical system.That statement I aver is unequivocal."

Depend on your definitions for "order", "chaos" and an "unguided physical system".
For me order is the opposite of complexity. The only proper definition for complex to work with you gave us in your link is from Kolmogorov.

But
"AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA"
is with the definition of Kolmogorov less complex than
"QWEIURMWFXVASWEWRMVCP=§LS=Q:XQE".

Therefore my feeling for what order is, is opposite of complexity.