Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Marine Organisms Threatened by Increasingly Acidic Ocean
Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution ^ | September 29, 2005 | Shelly Dawicki

Posted on 10/20/2005 11:55:23 AM PDT by cogitator

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-60 next last
To: cogitator
It's not the acid, it's the CO2, and the pH change is a lot more than the infinitesimal amount you offered. It's measurable.

Well, what's the measure?

21 posted on 10/20/2005 12:32:20 PM PDT by Moonman62 (Federal creed: If it moves tax it. If it keeps moving regulate it. If it stops moving subsidize it)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: cogitator

Someone please save the Hasidics in the oceans! How they got there, who's to know?


22 posted on 10/20/2005 12:34:43 PM PDT by Wally_Kalbacken
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Blueflag
"The limiting factor of phytoplankton growth is CO2 (presuming temp and sunlight are constant)."

I thought it had been shown that the limiting nutrient was trace iron??? And that adding just a small amount of iron caused massive blooms of phytoplankton??

23 posted on 10/20/2005 12:51:48 PM PDT by Wonder Warthog (\\)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: Moonman62
Well, what's the measure?

First decimal place. Surface pH has decreased about 0.1 pH unit since the late 1800s.

24 posted on 10/20/2005 12:53:05 PM PDT by cogitator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: Old Professer
Doesn't deposited CO2 in water concentrate at the coldest strata?

I'm not sure what you mean; but deep water formation will capture surface atmospheric CO2 concentrations and move them into the deep ocean.

25 posted on 10/20/2005 12:54:21 PM PDT by cogitator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Wonder Warthog
I thought it had been shown that the limiting nutrient was trace iron???

Depends on where you are. There's plenty of iron in coastal waters, so there nitrate and phosphate are the limiting nutrients. In the open ocean a long way from the continents, iron can be limiting.

26 posted on 10/20/2005 12:56:25 PM PDT by cogitator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: lilylangtree
It was renamed last night (on South Park). It's now "Two Days Before the Day After Tomorrow"
27 posted on 10/20/2005 12:58:15 PM PDT by Calvin Locke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: BadAndy

first you have to see if you can actually sustain the CO2 levels in such a large volume, with an equivalent environment and availability of other resources - or will the organisms simply use the CO2 and thus take it out of the system? ...Perhaps even as more CaCO3. Will the increase in acidity act upon the corals first, or upon the ocena floor and debris - which would result in an increase in materials available?


28 posted on 10/20/2005 12:59:49 PM PDT by lepton ("It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into"--Jonathan Swift)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: ClearCase_guy
What about all the sulphur dioxide that volcanoes spew into the atmosphere. I just happened to catch a show on Tambora
last weekend. Granted, it was in 1815, but the show claimed it ejected a 100 million tons, iirc, of sulphur (sulphur compounds?).
29 posted on 10/20/2005 1:02:32 PM PDT by Calvin Locke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: SAJ
H2O.NaCl + CO2 ==> something acidic?

Yes, though until you get to extreme concentrations you can ignore the NaCl part.

CO2 dissolved in water is carbonic acid.

30 posted on 10/20/2005 1:07:04 PM PDT by lepton ("It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into"--Jonathan Swift)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: SAJ
Would you please discuss how dissolving carbon dioxide in salt water increases the level of hydrogen ionisation? This seems entirely counterintuitive.

The salt is largely irrelevant, though at extremes it may act as a buffering agent. Soda water is slightly acidic. As example, watch how you can shine pennies in soda water - it is the carbonic acid which causes that effect.

31 posted on 10/20/2005 1:09:44 PM PDT by lepton ("It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into"--Jonathan Swift)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: cogitator

Plants in the ocean are just like land plants. They take in CO2 and photosynthesize it. If there is more CO2 it won't change the CO2 level. There will just be more plant growth. Sheesh.


32 posted on 10/20/2005 1:14:24 PM PDT by far sider
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SAJ
Where does the new hydrogen come from?

Water. Few acids have any major effect without the prescence of water.

Distilled pure water has a pH of 7, which is to say that the concentration of Hydronium ions and Hydroxide ions are both at 10^-7. It is these ions that have the majority of the acidic or basic effect.

33 posted on 10/20/2005 1:16:28 PM PDT by lepton ("It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into"--Jonathan Swift)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: cogitator
First decimal place. Surface pH has decreased about 0.1 pH unit since the late 1800s.

So if it was 7.3, it's now 7.2? What are the actual numbers?

34 posted on 10/20/2005 1:26:36 PM PDT by Moonman62 (Federal creed: If it moves tax it. If it keeps moving regulate it. If it stops moving subsidize it)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: cogitator

"Marine Organisms Threatened By Increasingly Acidic Ocean"

This is serious. Is it caused by the cold? Or all that ice? Have they had this problem in the tropics or in desert regions? How about the army or navy?

Oh wait, I Thought the headline read:

MARINE ORGASMS THREATENED BY INCREASING ARTIC OCEAN.


35 posted on 10/20/2005 1:30:57 PM PDT by Bar-Face (The Embassy helicopter is warming up.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: cogitator
Put some pteropods in a tank, lower the pH, see what happens. This should be an easy experiment to do.

It's been done (read the paragraph starting "As a complement to...")

As a complement to model projections, one of the study coauthors, Victoria Fabry from the Department of Biological Sciences at California State University San Marcos, set up two-day shipboard experiments and demonstrated how shells of live pteropods begin to dissolve when the corrosive conditions that are projected to occur by 2100 are met. “Those results,” Fabry says, “suggest that for subpolar and polar pteropods to survive, they will need either to adapt to the expected changes in seawater chemistry or move to warmer, lower-latitude surface waters,”
"Begin to dissolve" isn't a very scientific statement. The experiment also isn't a very good indicator of whether the little buggers can adapt.
36 posted on 10/20/2005 1:34:23 PM PDT by Moonman62 (Federal creed: If it moves tax it. If it keeps moving regulate it. If it stops moving subsidize it)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: Moonman62
So if it was 7.3, it's now 7.2? What are the actual numbers?

You're correct in the trend, but surface pH is in the 8.1 to 8.4 range. Deep ocean pH gets down to 7.5-7.6.

37 posted on 10/20/2005 2:03:51 PM PDT by cogitator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: Moonman62
The experiment also isn't a very good indicator of whether the little buggers can adapt.

That might take time. Individual organisms won't adapt; the change will be to populations and will be evolutionary.

38 posted on 10/20/2005 2:04:59 PM PDT by cogitator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: cogitator

I just read an article about insects that adapt to resist insecticides in a much shorter time frame.


39 posted on 10/20/2005 2:09:08 PM PDT by Moonman62 (Federal creed: If it moves tax it. If it keeps moving regulate it. If it stops moving subsidize it)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: cogitator

Where can I find some real numbers? I want to know more than just the trend.


40 posted on 10/20/2005 2:10:07 PM PDT by Moonman62 (Federal creed: If it moves tax it. If it keeps moving regulate it. If it stops moving subsidize it)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-60 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson