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To: Thatcherite

Believe that God directs what science treats as random if you wish, there is no way that science can ever test for that proposition so it is unscientific, but not inherently false or stupid.

Randomness does not mean there was no intelligence, design, or purpose. Scientists use randomness in their research, do they not?
It also depends on whether it appears or is random because what we think or expect to happen doesn't happen when we think it should.
The randomness could have simply been incorporated as a design feature; programmed in, as it were. There's no way to know if the randomness is truly ramdon in a non created universe or part of a greater plan which we are not aware of.
I don't think randomness can be a very good support for the ToE.


338 posted on 10/01/2005 1:11:31 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom
"Randomness does not mean there was no intelligence, design, or purpose. Scientists use randomness in their research, do they not?

True, but how do you test for I, D, or P?

"$It also depends on whether it appears or is random because what we think or expect to happen doesn't happen when we think it should.

Randomness is determined by statistical analysis not by unexpected results.

"The randomness could have simply been incorporated as a design feature; programmed in, as it were. There's no way to know if the randomness is truly ramdon in a non created universe or part of a greater plan which we are not aware of.

This is why ID cannot be considered a science, any number of hypotheses can be proposed with no way of eliminating any of them.

BTW, evolution, although not directed by an ID, it is directed by whatever selection forces are found in the organism's environment.

Strictly speaking, mutations are not truly random as some areas of the genome are more prone to mutations than others and some areas of the genome have corrective mechanisms that limit mutations.

"I don't think randomness can be a very good support for the ToE.

By itself, randomness is not support for or against the ToE. The ToE has many other supportive lines of evidence.

358 posted on 10/01/2005 8:51:50 PM PDT by b_sharp (Science adjusts theories to fit evidence, creationism distorts evidence to fit the Bible.)
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To: metmom
Believe that God directs what science treats as random if you wish, there is no way that science can ever test for that proposition so it is unscientific, but not inherently false or stupid.

Randomness does not mean there was no intelligence, design, or purpose. Scientists use randomness in their research, do they not? It also depends on whether it appears or is random because what we think or expect to happen doesn't happen when we think it should. The randomness could have simply been incorporated as a design feature; programmed in, as it were. There's no way to know if the randomness is truly ramdon in a non created universe or part of a greater plan which we are not aware of. I don't think randomness can be a very good support for the ToE.

We appear to be in agreement, except for the last sentence which came straight out of nowhere. It has no connection with the rest of what you typed.

363 posted on 10/01/2005 11:56:52 PM PDT by Thatcherite (Conservative and Biblical Literalist are not synonymous)
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