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1 posted on 09/24/2005 7:32:50 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam

2 posted on 09/24/2005 7:35:02 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
Hmmm... You first.


3 posted on 09/24/2005 7:37:44 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember
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To: blam
Space Elevators: Some Not-So-Talked About Problems that need Solving

Energy released when a fiber snaps.

A carbon nanotube that is stretched to 65 GPa has a very high energy density. I have estimated that if that energy is all converted into heat, the carbon nanotube would heat up on the order of 1000K to 4000K (depending on assumptions on the Young's modulus and the heat capacity of the material).

If a thread of the space elevator ribbon breaks and a significant amount of the energy it contains is released as heat, the resulting temperature rise could be sufficient to damage the adhesives that are supposed to be holding the thread to do load redistribution, and possibly damage the interconnect. The broken thread could also zip past many interconnects before the inertia of the free end of the thread prevents the energy to be released too violently (the heat radiates away very fast). This would leave lots of long threads sticking out of the elevator ribbon, ready to get tangled on advancing climbers. Given current estimates, it would seem that there would be many breaks per square meter of ribbon per year, so there would be a lot of these threads around.

The elastic energy that gets converted into kinetic energy could also have a negative impact on the interconnects, possibly damaging them or allowing the thread to zip through.

Thermal cycling when ribbon twists.

In space, the temperature of the ribbon is governed by radiative heat transport. When the ribbon is facing the sun, it equilibrates to a temperature around 300K. When it is perpendicular to the sun, it equilibrates to a temperature around 100K (I haven't checked these numbers myself, but they are in the right ball park). Because it is so thin, the ribbon's temperature will equilibrate within a few seconds only. Therefore, if the ribbon is twisting around randomly, it will be repeatedly be cycling from hot to cold to hot. This temperature cycling could cause some severe fatigue issues as it is repeated year after year after year. In fact, just the large range of temperatures could be a problem; polymers tend to have mechanical characteristics that vary significantly with temperature. Certainly a challenge for the materials folks. The thermal expansion caused by the temperature change could also induce oscillations in the ribbon, but I think that is a lesser concern.

One broken elevator could kill all deployed elevators.

If a space elevator breaks, a number of very long pieces of ribbon result. Ones attached to the Earth will fall down (pretty harmlessly for the people on the Earth); the others will orbit the Earth going West (unless I am mixed up). These ribbons will probably have a bit of motion out of the equatorial plane (at least tens of km in amplitude), and the total length of broken ribbon is very long, so there is a very good chance that they will strike other elevators that are around (and that are very large targets). The collision itself will usually be at relatively small velocities, so it shouldn't be a problem. On the other hand, after colliding, the ribbons may rub against each other, get caught on each other resulting in ribbon damage, or increase each other's tension. It seems to me that this could severely damage or even break the elevator that is still standing.

Having multiple elevators was supposed to be insurance; it may turn out to be more like putting all your explosives in the same box.

5 posted on 09/24/2005 7:42:54 PM PDT by SteveMcKing ("I was born a Democrat. I expect I'll be a Democrat the day I leave this earth." -Zell Miller '04)
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To: blam
The race is on to build the first "space elevator' - long dismissed as science fiction

New #1 terror target.

If the tether ever broke the people in the hotel are in the deep weeds.

6 posted on 09/24/2005 7:44:05 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (Mesocons for Rice '08)
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To: blam
[...contrast it to Nasa's announcement last week that it will be relying on 40-year-old technology from the Apollo programme...]



The "space elevator" is an ingenious idea and I hope it becomes feasible someday, but this dig about NASA using 40 year old technology is just plain wrong. It's like saying your 2006 model car is using Model T technology. It may be true in a vague way, but not in any practical real world sense.
8 posted on 09/24/2005 7:49:42 PM PDT by spinestein (Forget the Golden Rule. Remember the Brazen Rule.)
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To: blam

oh, sorry....saw the title of the thread and it was just a natural occurrence....

14 posted on 09/24/2005 9:14:45 PM PDT by God luvs America (When the silent majority speaks the earth trembles!)
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To: blam

Don't tell the Moslems.


18 posted on 09/24/2005 9:26:33 PM PDT by Hank Rearden (Never allow anyone who could only get a government job attempt to tell you how to run your life.)
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To: blam
I am sorry, but this is pure folly. It is nice to dream and dreams drive advances, but this is goofy. I have a pretty open mind when it comes to science and this seems like someone begging for a nice fat grant to get that house in the Hamptons they always wanted.
19 posted on 09/25/2005 10:40:30 AM PDT by satchmodog9 (Murder and weather are our only news)
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