Posted on 09/16/2005 5:14:37 PM PDT by Crackingham
Funny, my kiddo worked at 14, during the summer, with parental consent. And before that, she babysat. So what's your excuse for not getting a job, any job, at that age?
It still sticks in your craw, that you weren't allowed to cook outside the house, at 15, doesn't it? And that's why your posts sound like a petulant teenager; you've never emotionally matured beyond that age.
Yes, some girls married/ were married off at young ages and no, they all didn't turn out well at all. You've never bothered to read any Ibsen or Dickens or any nonfiction about previous eras. If you had, you wouldn't keep on harping about this...which is quite an immature thing to do.
Here's one for ya...Mohamed married a 6 year old girl, but waited until she was all of 9, before consummating the marriage. Things like that happened; it doesn't mean that it was okay.
My behavior, on this thread, has been exemplary; considering whom I'm dealing with.
Oh, I was more than ready and ABLE to raise a wonderful, intelligent, responsible child, whom you are nowhere near near as intelligent, capable, responsible, nor mature as. And unlike you, she is soon going to be a wonderful parent.
I hope that you never have any children; especially not a girl!
In the Middle Ages, babies/toddlers went directly into semi-adulthood, bypassing childhood completely.
Even in the early Industrial Age through early Edwardian times, the poor and lower class went from babyhood into a semi-adulthood. And no, that was NOT a good thing. Six year old chimney-sweeps and 8 year old factory workers weren't emotionally prepared, nor intellectually ready for adulthood, just because by the age of 15, if they lived that long, they had been out working for years already.
No you were an early bloomer it happens. I'm talking about the averages, by 15 we're physically ready, we should be mentally ready by then.
I don't pine away for anybody, happily married for 13 years, don't need to pine.
Looking at the body tells you EVERYTHING about what SHOULD be the emotional state of the person IF they had been raised by a society that had the right goals.
Funny you calling me immature since you started off insulting me from your very first post on this thread. That's classic 14 year old behavior.
Actually I was in the state gifted and talented program starting in 4th grade and graduated high school with 12 college credits already to my name (AP classes). Funny how obsessed you are with devaluing me as a person, just deal with the fact, poisoning the well is nothing more than a logical fallacy, grossly immature, highly transparent, and in this case is failing miserably.
Some children are coddled until they're 30 because we keep calling them children for ever. Call them adults when we want them to be adults and make them act like adults. One of the big things we miss when dealing with that transition is nothing can really and truly make a person ready for adulthood like adulthood. You can't learn responsibility without having soemthing to be responsible for. You can't pay bills until you have bills to pay. You can't raise kids until you have kids to raise. We've gotten obsessed with this concept of "ready", everybody wants their kids to be "ready" before they leave but the reality is you can't be "ready" until you leave. But in this constant quest for "ready" we keep moving the expected line of adulthood further and further back, which accomplishes nothing positive for anybody.
I really wish you'd stop insulting and belittling me, don't sigh, act like an adult and discuss this like an adult. Adults don't need to insult people they disagree with, adults can deal with facts.
The 60s is the era when college became much more wide open and a much wider subsection of American society started going. This is a simple historical reality, to quote you "look it up". This broadening of the percentage of our youth seeking additional schooling (for a large variety of social, economic, and political reasons) caused the immature years to expand. Check out Woodstock, lots of "kids" who were an age that just 10 or 15 years ago would have been considered adult without even the sense to get in out of the rain or to bring as many sets of clothes as days they planned to be out. Expanded immaturity captured on film forever with an occasionally pretty good soundtrack.
No I am pointing out painfully obvious facts. And the faxct that with every single post you are resorting to more and more base ad hominems proves that even you know the facts are on my side. If you had confidence in the facts you'd stick to them, your need to insult shows you have no confidence in the facts, thus showing you know the facts prove me right. Be an adult, go one entire post without insulting me, I bet you can if you try really really hard... but I'm equally positive you won't even try. If you can't muster a post without insults then don't bother with another post, I feel no need to waste my time with people that know their facts can't carry their argument but aren't mature enough to deal with it.
Gee more insults, not just more insults but recycled insults. That's it, we're done. Grow up, stop insulting people.
I homeschool my three, also (10, 9 and 5). They go to a one half-day a week co-op kind of class for other hs'ers in the area. My son just went to his first day of 'kindergarten class' on Tuesday. It's only 3 hours once a week, and I thought my heart would break. when my older girls went, the two of us used to spend the morning running errands or just spending time together, getting a donut, shopping, going for walks, etc...
He enjoys the class, but is worried about me- always asking if I'm lonely and reassuring me that he is having fun and not to worry. He said I should just go and have fun doing my 'mommy things'. Yesterday he made me a bracelet out of pipecleaner and beads. When he put it on my wrist he said it was so I could think of him when he's in his class. why would I ever want to 'get rid' of this kid by sending him away for 8 hours a day? No way, I love my kids AND the time we spend together learning and growing every day.
Once again destructive feminism has to have its face rubbed in reality.
Sorry to hear that the school issue is such a problem. We homeschooled and I couldn't imagine sending my 5 yr. old off. They're still such babies. I would worry and miss them, too.
You have more than any career woman in this whole world and your legacy will go on forever.
The hand that rocks the cradle, rules the world.
My son is extremely thoughtful and compassionate like that. Between the ages of 3 and 8, life was he!! for us but we survived it and now he is a delightful young man of fifteen and I am so proud of him and I be sure to let him know. I knew a pastor's wife who had a TYPICAL pastor's kid for a son. They went through a lot but she was consistent and firm and it paid. He turned out to be a wonderful, polite young man. You could have knocked me out with a feather when I saw him after about 10 yrs; but I ALWAYS remembered it. It was a great encouragement for me and now I've had the joy of seeing it pay off. I know that there is still room for problems but I think that he's pretty much past that at almost 16. (WOW) Hang in there during the tough times cause it pays and it won't last forever. (Now I want to go give him a big hug, but he's sleeping, As I should be. OOPS)
You unfortunately will never know what a child means.
After WW II, those ages began to fall, for a number of different reasons.
Your posts have been those of a very immature individual and as such, I responded as was due a petulant teen. Obviously, you can't see yourself, as others see you; however, only a child going through the terrible two stage, or a young teen, would harp on erroneous positions, demanding that they be being taken for fact, as you keep doing; not to mention your dependence on the rare as over riding the "norm".
Looking at the body of many a 13 year old boy would belie the fact that they are capable of having an erection and fathering a child. Many 13 year old boys still look like little kids; so do some 15 year olds.
Please desist from using that canard, as it is meritless and not founded on anything factual. There are some 15 year old girls, who may look as though they can become pregnant, but who have yet to have their first period. There are 14 year old girls, who have long ago reached menarche, but who still have the body shape of someone who hasn't yet entered puberty.
LOOKING AT A BODY TELLS YOU LITTLE, IF ANYTHING ! There are men and women who are sterile, but look as though they have the ability to have children. There are women with no real hop definition, who have children easily. There are wide hipped women, who need Cesarean sections, because they are incapable of a vaginal birth.
Maybe you just knew how to take tests. :-)
For whatever reason, you aren't well educated; you aren't evenly remotely knowledgeable about this topic. Ergo, however well, or not, you did in school, you are talking about a topic about which you are incompetent to discuss factually.
By the 1960s, more people were going to college and on to grad schools, than previously, but compared to the explosion of kids going to college after wards, it was still a small number; though a far larger one than in the late '30s and early '40s. Many went to college after WW II, who otherwise never would have, due to the G.I. Bill. Then, there was a bit of slump in the mid 50s, before the uptick of the '60s. Then the flood gates opened and lots of people are now going to college, who really shouldn't.
Hmmmmmmmmm...Woodstock? You wanna talk about an era I lived through and you didn't? Okay. LOL
An awful lot of those kids, who you see in the films, aren't as old as you think they are. And the older ones were an anomaly. In the mid to late '60s, most 20 somethings were responsible ADULTS! The hippie wannabes, who spent their weekends in Washington Square Park and other places in Greenwich Village, were high schoolers from the outer boroughs and the suburbs.
And WHY did they not have the sense to come in out of the rain? Well, there really was no place to go into and they were stoned.
Who calls 30 year olds "children", besides you? Today's society doesn't!
Children should be taught responsibility at home, from at least the age of three. Parents are responsible to teach their children responsibility; not society.
No, you keep "pointing out" fallacious, spurious, erroneous junk, which you keep insisting is hard, cold, fact.
And BTW, the "music" played at Woodstock stank!
You haven't posted a single FACT; OTOH, you have completely and utterly ignored the many facts that I have posted. You have posted your opinions as facts. That doesn't wash...sorry.
Let's for the nonce, take England as the example. In preReformation England, amongst the landed gentry ( that would be the upper middle class to you and might even, at times, inc,lude the middle, middle class ), the eldest son inherited everything, which made it virtually impossible for most younger sons and some, not all daughters, to marry. The eldest sons married in their early 20s.
"In the late 17th and 18th centuries, there was a distinct trend towards batchelordom among owners of medium to large country houses in three sample counties."
"Daughters married on the average of at twenty in the late sixteenth century, rising to about twenty-two to twenty-three in the late seventeenth and eighteenth."
"The median age for first marriage of heirs of English squirarchy was about twenty-one in the early sixteenth century, twenty-two in the late sixteenth century, twenty-four rising to twenty-six in the seventeenth and early eighteenth centuries, and twenty-seven to twenty-nine in the late eighteenth to early nineteenth centuries. "
By the eighteenth century, younger sons who did marry, were marrying in their mid to late thirties.
"Amoung the plebs, the age of marriage followed a remarkably different pattern. It has now been established beyond any doubt that all over north-west Europe, with some unexplained regional exceptions, the middle and lower classes of both sexes married remarkably late, certainly from the fifteenth century onward........... A very large quantity of evidence for France, some for Italy, and a certain amount for England and America, proves that among small property owners and labourers the median age of first marriage was very high in the sixteenth century and went even higher in the seventeenth and part of the eighteenth centuries, rising from twenty-seven to twenty-eight for men and from twenty-five to twenty-seven for women."
The above is either quoted directly or paraphrased from " THE FAMILY, SEX, AND MARRIAGE IN ENGLAND 1500-1800", by Lawrence Stone. His figures come from church and government files of the periods discussed. I'd be more than happy to supply you with another 1/2 dozen books on the topic, if you find this one source not adequate.
Fascinating post, as are all of yours on this thread.
Your understanding of history is most appreciated.
Life began for me with the birth of our children, now grown.
When I grow up, I want to be just like them. ";^)
Sexy teenagers sure do look mature enough, don't they?
I feel sorry for guys these days, of all ages...
I also feel sorry for girls who don't buy into the fashion trash.
Just try and find non butt crack jeans for teens.
I do love history and am a stickler for facts. It always rankles me, when people post erroneous junk, demand that it be taken as factual, and then get more than a little upset, when proven wrong. Just because someone repeats spurious things over and over again, doesn't make it so. And so, I jump in and post the for real facts.
I think that it's wonderful that you love your children so very much! I love my kiddo too. :-)
Thank you very much. We consider ourselves very fortunate.
Thank you, that's what I think. I had my career, when my oldest kids were babies, and I gave my notice the day my husband graduated from college. My boss said, "Is there anything we can do to change your mind?" and I showed him a picture of my Bill and said, "NOTHING! Thanks for all the paychecks, Jim, but this boy is my Real Life!"
It's funny that women in middle age who don't have families (such as those discussed in this article) are considered objects of pity by the MSM. I've been told I should be more sympathetic toward those who haven't been blessed as I have. I don't get that. They made their tradeoffs, and I made mine. There seems to be an unspoken (maybe unspeakable?) assumption, deep down, that a family is just a better value than a career.
Feminism encouraged Women in the delusion that they could focus on a career then when they were ready they could marry and have kids. This is an evolutionary dead end. Feminists are mostly angry Lesbians who hate Men, Boys, Families, Children and love death. They are destroying Western Christian culture and its tolerant pluralistic institutions. They are truly evil deranged and mentally ill Women.
Biology trumps politics. Women should marry young have children raise those kids then pursue a career there is time for that. Women's looks fade rapidly after age 30. This is just biology. Fertility declines rapidly after age 30. By age 35 their biological clocks are bonging like Big Ben in London. Gender is not a social construction.
The male brain has 10 times the Grey Matter as the Female Brain. There are profound differences in the two genders. Feminism says this is not so. Feminists are clueless idiots.
And we must purge the FemNags from our culture.
I can give you an answer as to why one would want kids. I can give you lots of answers:
1. Because I want them
2. Because I love kids
3. Because the love they give in return is indescribeable
4. Because holding a warm, sweet baby is beyond words
5. Because this baby is the result of love by two people
6. Because itis my opportunity to teach right and wrong
7. Because there is nothing like looking down into the crib at night when your baby is asleep and feeling the love for him/her
8. Because a home is complete with children
9. Because their presence will warm the hearts of their grandparents
10. They will be a brother or sister to another or more babies in your household.
11. Because I can teach them about God
12. Because I can teach them their prayers
13. Because I can teach them to be good to all people
14. Because I can teach them to pray for those less fortunate
15. Because I can show them the way
and lastly:
Because they are what constitutes a family. Now, I can leave this thread too and go give my little grandson a kiss and then get on my knees to thank God for bringing this little person into our lives. Then I can bake him some little cookies with funny faces and Easter I can teach him how to dye eggs and put the Easter Lily and a Cross on some of the eggs....the reasons my friend for wanting children goes on and on and there are not enough words, ink, or paper to put them on.
Therefore, you will just have to take people's words for their reasons for having children. It's beyond anything else in this world. To see them grow to mature, loving individuals who love God, Country and Family is worth far more than the highest paycheck any company could ever even begin to imagine giving any employee. Nope...you just can't imagine.
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