Katrina Live Thread, Part XIII

Various ^ | 1 September 2005 | Various

[hipaatwo]

Nightline..

The President says help is on the way BUT it's late and it's not sufficient.

T.V. off!

[Smogger]

Good to hear. 500 troops though? Since we have a population of 30+ million and are the 7th largest economy, and have the highest concentration of wealth in the world I would hope we could do a little better than that. Heck we can provide medical care for 1.5 million illegals.

[AmericanInTokyo]

It is more out of a social structure and sense of social obligation (allegiance to the GROUP for the greater, larger good), that allows the Japanese in general, with a few minor exceptions, to sublimate personal issues, wants and desire and impatience, and be more 'other' centered. There is little mentality of 'entitlement'. Thus, they have a much much longer shelf life of patience in these kinds of disastrous things, and generally don't come unglued like we are seeing in New Orleans. It is not so much Buddhist or Shinto temperment, as it is 'Japanese village culture' (shudan dotoku) of not being self-centered and selfish, but rather, self-reliant, cooperative, respectful of authority and it's orders, and full of pride, obligation, brave in the face of discomfort and pain, sense of 'face', loyalty and honor (and shame at the risk of ostracism, if one decides to do wrong). The ghetto morality in the United States is almost the opposite. It is in precisely doing WRONG and acts of extreme selfishness, then one is "included" and not ostracized and one must be evil and tough and even menacing to survive at times.

[Txsleuth]

Scarborough is in funny looking boots, just shaking his head, like "Bad President Bush, bad President Bush...you once again let down citizens of America....sigh"

[Alberta's Child]

Actually, as far as houses are concerned the biggest issue will not be the structural integrity of the frames. Most of these homes will have to be completely rebuilt because of mold infestation -- especially if they are inundated with water for longer than a few days.

If it is a total loss, how in gawds name can they rebuild some entire neighborhoods on taxpayers' back? If so, I can see a $300 billion to $1 trillion repair job.

Insurance companies will take a lot of time to process the claims on any insured properties, and they'll end up paying a substantial part of the cost (assuming that most of these buildings are insured). Don't feel bad for them, though -- because insurance is their business and they make a lot of money for themselves anticipating how to cope with a major catastrophe like this. Insurance stocks always take a huge hit in the aftermath of a disaster of this magnitude, but they end up recovering quite nicely because their losses are usually far less than even "smart" investors anticipate.

Insurance settlements in New Orleans may be smaller than you think, since an insurance company is obligated to cover the loss of the structure itself -- but not the land on which it sits. If I live in a $500,000 home that is comprised of a $250,000 house on a piece of property worth $250,000, then the insurance company's maximum exposure is $250,000, not $500,000. In an area like New Orleans that was below sea level even before it was inundated with water, most insurance companies (actually, all of them) will write checks for the entire value of the structure and pay out the claim rather than rebuild the structure.

On a few other threads I posted my list of reasons why I don't think New Orleans is ever going to rebuilt to its former state. Any comments on these would be welcome:

1. If you could start all over again, you wouldn't build New Orleans where it is located right now -- mainly because the terrain has changed so much over the years (it's been sinking continuously) that the city no longer has the "advantage of place" that made it a viable area to settle 200+ years ago.

2. Point #1 could apply to a lot of places (someone mentioned places like San Francisco, Anchorage, etc. in this regard), but from a practical standpoint it never makes sense to just get everybody out of a city, destroy the buildings, and start all over again everywhere else. In this case, however, these practical obstacles to shutting down an entire city do not apply. The city already has been evacuated, and at least 80% of the buildings already have been destroyed or so severely damaged that the cost of repairing them won't be much less than the cost of replacing them. The most sobering aspect of this disaster is that for the first time in U.S. history, it was deemed necessary to fully evacuate a metropolitan area of 1.4 million people. Step back for a moment think about that -- and realize the implications of this unprecedented measure.

3. From a political standpoint, I don't think anyone who looks at the situation objectively would even want to see New Orleans rebuilt. This is mainly because from this point forward it could only function as a massive public works project that turns into a city in which the government owns 100% of the land. Just think about this for a moment . . . the most far-reaching implication of this disaster is that land titles in a city below sea level are basically worthless. This means that no prudent investor will ever buy a piece of property, no bank will ever extend a mortgage without extensive government guarantees, and no insurance companies would underwrite a property/casualty policy in a rebuilt New Orleans.

[Mr. Jeeves]

The Hayward Fault is very bad news - the maximum potential quake is supposedly "only" 7.5, but it goes right through the heavily populated cities of the East Bay, with lots of unreinforced masonry buildings. It would also take out the Bay Bridge and BART, so no one would be getting into San Francisco from the east.

The next Big One is thought to be most likely, though, to occur not in the San Francisco Bay Area, but on the San Andreas at Tejon Pass, north of Los Angeles. They have had an 8.5 approximately every 150 years going back a long time...and it's been 160+ years since the last one.

[oceanview]

The DNC got to Blanco early - told her to go easy on maintaining civil order, it would hamper the FEMA effort. I am convinced of this 100% seeing how this has unfolded.

[Arizona Carolyn]

So I see Nicolas Cage is giving a million dollars, other stars are kicking in money... so I say, hmmm Oprah is from Mississippi. Oprah is a kazillionaire. Wonder how much she has donated to her home state. Did a google search. Not a peep.

[samantha]

Yowsa!

[XEHRpa]

> Still puzzling about how to evenly space 49 stars on the flag, tho'.
However, I am certain that it can be done.

You're joking, right?

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[HoHoeHeaux]

I am f*cking outraged. I work and do not have access to TV until late night and just saw the Bill O' Reilly rerun interviewing Shepard Smith. How dare he. He cut Shep off every sentence and lay the blame on anyone he could think of. Shep is there, living in hellish conditions, trying like hell to report what he is seeing, what the people are living. BOR cut him shout, would not let him finish a thought.
Let me see if I can stop this thread in it's tracks. I don't see the problem except maybe for the curses.

Pulled from Extended News. My 2nd topic in my 2 years on FR.
I do not abuse this board. Someone tellme what Idid wro

Shep is doing an excellent job down there, while BOR sits in his office pointing fingers. It's not the time for that. Why is this idiot still on TV? When the segmet ended, Bill closed it by "hoping you win every award there is". He accused Shep of doing this for his career! Shep should have told him to F off at that point.

We need to get this guy off the air.

[eternity]

Roger that!

[MMkennedy]

"I didn't see any armed thugs stopping anyone from delivering food or water to the folks at the convention center (which they did eventually.)"

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/09/01/D8CBN9OG2.html
"In hopes of defusing the unrest at the convention center, Mayor Ray Nagin gave the refugees permission to march across a bridge to the city's unflooded west bank for whatever relief they can find. But the bedlam at the convention center appeared to make leaving difficult.

A military heliocpter tried to land at the convention center several times to drop off food and water. But the rushing crowd forced the choppers to back off. Troopers then tossed the supplies to the crowd from 10 feet off the ground and flew away."

[Will_Zurmacht]

didn't ya love the end..."We're not being political here, we would treat Clinton the same way.."

sigh

[steveegg]

And with that, I'm ready to call it a night.

See you all tomorrow.

[No Blue States]

"Red Cross says this is 9/11 and Andrew combined, with probably over 10k dead."

The expected death toll continues to rise. Its all so hard to believe.

That was a sobbering report about the Astrodome and what is happening. The ripple effects of all of this are going to be widespread.
I wonder if the refugess are allowed to just leave the Astrodome.

[NautiNurse]

Wowser - this story is beyond wonderful.

It's way too easy for folks removed from the situation to forget that the immediate/first responders:

a) didn't sleep while the storm screamed, and

b) lost their homes and possessions during and after the storm.

Another fabulous example of heroes. Thank you very much for this report.

[MEG33]

Need a cookie?

[bwteim]

Ditto.

[Lessismore]

We have no legal reason to just take over a state. We are the United States, and each State has its sovereignty. If we did not have laws on the books to protect each state's legal authority then what would stop Congress or a President from invoking all kinds of nonsense to take over a State that was not on the same page as them.

My guess is that it would take a "Presidential Finding" followed by and "Executive Order", possibly backed up by a "Congressional Resolution".

Bear in mind that it doesn't take a "Declaration of War" by Congress as prescribed by the Constitution for the President to take the nation to war anymore.