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To: popdonnelly
Could you explain to us why the survival of Israel is not of interest to us?

Why do you ask?

Is it your primary concern?

528 posted on 08/10/2005 6:03:24 PM PDT by iconoclast (Wastin' away again in hearts-and-minds'ville.)
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To: iconoclast

It's not my primary concern, but it is a concern. As, for example, the survival of Western Europe was a concern during the Cold War. As I said earlier, I don't see why the destruction of Israel is a proper subject for international discussion. I don't hear similar expressions of disdain for, say, Azerbaijan or Zimbabwe.


539 posted on 08/10/2005 6:14:19 PM PDT by popdonnelly
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To: iconoclast

I like to think of the situation of Israel (and/or Jews, depending on the specific issue) as a sort of Canary for the West. Because if that canary drops over, it means all of us miners had best get the hell outta Dodge, and fast, or in a few minutes we are going to meet its fate.

If Israel falls, that means someone was strong enough and ruthless eough to take it down. And if they hate Israel, that means they almost assuredly hate America. And if they were willing to absorb the losses to take down the little Satan, how much more are they willing to sacrifice to destroy the great Satan? The mackdaddy of democracy, capitalism, and the force for modernization. My guess is: a HELL of a lot. And if someone is strong enough to take down Israel, a) they are strong enough to severely hurt us, if not topple us b) enjoying some sort of support network and c) clearly making a play for power, and challenging America, daring it to come after them (Ha, you can't! We have killed the little Satan, and massacred the Jews and driven their children into the sea! You dare not invade! we have the anthrax, we have the nuclear weapon! Death to America!)

Which, I am sure you will agree, is not a great situation for us to be in. This way, a) Israel is going to keep them occupied, or at least split their attention b) We are upholding our values and supporting a fellow democracy c) We have a canary in the mineshaft d) They are a continuing source of nice things: HUGE medical advancements (like you wouldn't believe), a strong market for American goods and investment, and investers in America e) A regional voice f) A supporting voice at the U.N., which you notice we are quite short of g) We are keeping world peace. Israel is a nuclear power, and has M.A.D. in place (read: Nuclear war is bad, and we don't want it. Therefore, so Israel does not launch nukes in retaliation for its destruction, and unleashes more chaos, we should keep it alive) h) Why not support Israel? What have they ever done to us? (Also for that matter, though, we should support Taiwan, the reformers in Iran, etc. etc)

I could keep going, but I think you see my drift.

It's not my primary concern. My primary concern is that the ideals, values and philosophies that made the West great live on forevermore and are continuously championed, even when we are gone, new powers have risen and fallen, and all humans have a fourth set of limbs and six eyes. That's my primary concern. Supporting Israel is a means to that end.


542 posted on 08/10/2005 6:16:26 PM PDT by Alexander Rubin (Octavius - You make my heart glad building thus, as if Rome is to be eternal.)
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