Cindy Sheehan: "My son joined the Army to protect America, not Israel."

Cindy's Usenet Posts ^ | Various | Cindy Sheehan

[Dave Olson]

Hussein did not allow Islamists to organize on a large scale. He was keeping them under his thumb.

Keeping them under his thumb, my ass! He was giving people like Abu Nidal and Zarqawi sanctuary. He even had a passenger jet in Salman Pak that was used to train hijackers.

[Publius6961]

The longer that this insane useful idiot hangs out with her "progressive" masters, the more idiotic is the stuff coming out of her mouth.

[Frank_Discussion]

And sponsoring suicide bombers!

[Sam Hill]

Hussein did not allow Islamists to organize on a large scale. He was keeping them under his thumb.

[Alexander Rubin]

Fair enough. I can understand your perspective.

[nopardons]

Well, if you want to be an opera star, or even a highly paid second tier, then yes, you would have to move to where there are grand opera houses are. That would mean a large city. The same is true for people who want to be floor traders on the prominent exchanges and other things like that. But no, nobody is "FORCED BY INDUSTRIALISTS", to move to cities. And they weren't forced to move to cities when the Industrial Revolution came about either. They moved there of their own free will. It wasn't a case of starve or move.

People have always moved to cities for many different reasons, from time immemorial.

[iconoclast]

First let me say thank you, notigar, for bringing the baseless charges and irrelevant rant of this scurrilous slanderer to my attention.

Iconoclast has a strange inability to see how his remarks so closely parallel the early antisemitism of pre-Reich Germany of the thirties.

The only thing close to a parallel to the era in which your mind is stuck is a powerful, headstrong leader who did not hesitate to preemptively invade a weak non-threatening nation on the basis of trumped up charges.

Of course every politician with an overseas problem and every demagogue with an axe to grind can always be counted on to raise the Hitler hobgoblin. History will probably never provide those on thin ice a better diversionary tactic.

But I repeat, there are no parallels here sir and your attempts to overlay 2001 with a 30's and 40's template are pathetic. It matters not how much heat and spittle with which you present them.

His flawed opinions about why we are in Iraq, or extremely off-the-mark comments about giving up on OBL (psst... we're still in Afghanistan) notwithstanding,

Quite so DB, and it seems be a mark of pride for you that we continue to shed blood there while OBL (the evil manipulator that brought death and destruction to Manhattan FOUR years ago) sits comfortably undisturbed just a few miles away ..... smirking, recruiting, training, planning, and executing.

Meanwhile, two nations away, we are busy setting up voting booths, hammering together a gallows for an evil, old despot who was never for a moment a serious threat to our nation, and carrying off the bodies of our dead and horribly wounded sitting-duck troops.

BTW, speaking of recruiting, I see in today's news that we are attempting to raise the recruitment entry age for ALL services to FORTY-TWO.

And so it goes. Have you neocons and Bushies no shame?

[Alexander Rubin]

Well, not necessarily. I'm part of the next wave of conservatives: I'm only 20. The Romans believed that between 50 and 65 was a man's prime. So, get cracking. ;)

[nopardons]

I wasn't talking to you and no, I haven't seen it first hand, but I have read a great deal about what living in rural America was like throughout this nation's history. It was just as I described, for many. The loneliness drove many insane. The weather killed many. The life was hard, dirty, harsh, and mostly unpleasant.

A village in Poland isn't what the person who yearned to live like a hermit was talking about. But it is extremely doubtful that he would last a week in such a village.

But since you enjoyed it, why don't you go back there and stay?

[katya8]

Here's a definitve description of why Sheehan is in the wrong.

[nopardons]

YIKES!

[nopardons]

That's a good place!

I'm glad that they led you to FR. :-)

[Rosemont]

Limbaugh is blasting Sheehan and her Michael Moore Leftist views beautifully right now (and CBS for a typically biased story about her)

[Alexander Rubin]

Here is where I do disagree with you vehemently Iconoclast. There is a connection between 1930s Germany and Britain (and the U.S.) and the U.S. of today.

On the one hand, we have all these wackos demanding that we appease the terrorists, who initiated the conflict I might add, that we seek to understand them, that we give in to their demands, so that we might have "peace in our time".

On another, we have and had isolationists like yourself who wanted to declare a "pox on all houses", insisting that the fight would never come to us if we just stayed out.

And then, we have people who saw the threat for what it was. War is never good, but it's not necessarily the worse thing either. The consequences of not fighting, or capitulating are far worse than fighting.

We can either stop the budding Islamofascists now, and hurt ourselves while doing so, but enjoy a decent chance of success. Or we can do nothing, hope for the best while they build their strength, their courage and raise armies in our midst and try to turn our wives and daughters and mothers and sisters into chattel and ourselves and our sons and brothers and fathers into corpses, or spineless dhimmis.

[A. Pole]

But since you enjoyed it, why don't you go back there and stay?

I enjoyed several different places but I cannot be everywhere. Anyway this village changed since my childhood and it is completely modernised.

My point is that the old way of life was not so hellish as some people think.

[Alexander Rubin]

So am I, my friend, so am I. ;)

[johnb838]

Until then, I will just uphold him as an example of a wise, faithful and G-dly man.

Of course, and I don't have time for a long discussion, but if he was not the Christ, then most of what he said was Blasphemy of the worst kind, and the Chief Priests and Pharisees had every right, nay duty to have him crucified. In fact, they may have had a duty anyway to prevent a massacre by the Romans. We talk of his taking our pain upon himself and being our martyr... it seems to me the Romans were getting ready to come down hard on all the unrest. Anyway, it says that Caiaphas had the idea that it was better that one man die for the people. I'm not one that holds all the Jews of the era as evil. In fact, I see many who had followed him as hugely disappointed that he had come with such promise yet showed himself to be just another frail, skin and bones, human being in the end, subject to Roman whim like all the rest.

[nopardons]

I'm listening to Rush too and heard it. :-)

[Alexander Rubin]

An interesting perspective. I think that his distinction between the letter of the laws of faith and their spirit is an important one, however. Anyways, back to the discussion on Cindy Sheehan...

[Frank_Discussion]

"The only thing close to a parallel to the era in which your mind is stuck is a powerful, headstrong leader who did not hesitate to preemptively invade a weak non-threatening nation on the basis of trumped up charges."

So no data, then?

"Of course every politician with an overseas problem and every demagogue with an axe to grind can always be counted on to raise the Hitler hobgoblin. History will probably never provide those on thin ice a better diversionary tactic.

But I repeat, there are no parallels here sir and your attempts to overlay 2001 with a 30's and 40's template are pathetic. It matters not how much heat and spittle with which you present them."

Still, no data. just claims. Okay. I didn't bring Hitler's name into it, you did. The antisemitism of 30's/40's in Europe and our enabling of it here in America is documented, concrete, and conveniently ignored by you. The parallels to the climate then and now are striking, but that doesn't suit your worldview.

"Quite so DB..."

DB?

"...seems to be a mark of pride for you that we continue to shed blood there..."

Pride, no. But I thought you wanted us to catch him, or do you not? Make up your mind.

"...while OBL (the evil manipulator that brought death and destruction to Manhattan FOUR years ago) sits comfortably undisturbed just a few miles away ..... smirking, recruiting, training, planning, and executing."

I don't know how uncomfortable OBL is, and neither do you. I *suspect* he is not at all comfortable, unless perhaps he is going without the whole breathing thing. But, no, if he is still able to operate his organization, it doesn't make me happy. It's a mark of absurdity on your part to think that it pleases me.

"Meanwhile, two nations away, we are busy setting up voting booths, hammering together a gallows for an evil, old despot who was never for a moment a serious threat to our nation..."

Sure, okay. And we have no allies he threatened, either.

"...and carrying off the bodies of our dead and horribly wounded sitting-duck troops."

Sorry, I am not a Mengele. Suffering of human beings is not something I treasure, but neither am I childlike enough to believe that it will ever be eliminated. That also goes for war, which by sad necessity begets suffering.

"BTW, speaking of recruiting, I see in today's news that we are attempting to raise the recruitment entry age for ALL services to FORTY-TWO."

Yes.

"And so it goes. Have you neocons and Bushies no shame?"

Who are you speaking to? I've defined at length why I consider your remarks antisemitic, but not you or one of your defenders has explained (to my knowledge) what a Neo-Con is, from your perspective at least. You throw the name around like you mean it, but I don't think you have a concrete thought of what defines the term.


And so it goes. Have you neocons and Bushies no shame?