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To: street_lawyer; Mrs. Don-o; wideawake; RKBA Democrat; Convert from ECUSA; GipperGal; Romulus
According to Catholic dogma, Mary is a co-redemptrist, which seem to suggest that salvation through the Blood of Jesus is not sufficient. I would venture to say that it would be difficult to find a Catholic who even understands what I have just said.

Jesus, the New Adam, is the one Savior and Redeemer of all humankind. By His Incarnation, Death and Resurrection, He redeems us from the sin of the first Adam. Mary, the New Eve, plays a lesser, dependent, subordinate role in the redemption of the world, by virtue of her relation to Christ and her cooperation in His life's mission. So she is sometimes called the Coredemptrix, which means "Woman with the Redeemer" (not "co-redeemer"; see below).

Though many Catholics believe in the legitimacy of this title, it has not been defined as an article of faith, and probably will not be in the forseeable future. Although the concept behind the title is theologically sound, Catholics are not required to accept the title "Coredemptrix".

Mary cannot and does not redeem us by herself. She only plays a lesser, non-essential role in the redemptive work of Christ. The Coredemptrix concept re-emphasizes the fact that Jesus is the Redeemer, for if He weren't then Mary could not be the Coredemptrix.

Allow me to cite an example. Several years ago, Roy Schoeman, a Harvard Business School professional, took a walk along the beach at Cape Cod. Suddenly ....

"As I was walking, lost in my thoughts, I found myself in the immediate presence of God.  It is as though I "fell into Heaven."  Everything changed from one moment to the next, but in such a smooth and subtle way that I was not aware of any discontinuity.  I felt myself in the immediate presence of God.  I was aware of His infinite exaltedness, and of His infinite and personal love for me.  I saw my life as though I was looking back on it after death, in His presence, and could see everything which I would be happy about and everything which I would wish I had done differently.  I saw that every action I had ever done mattered, for good or for evil.  I saw that everything which had ever happened in my life had been perfectly designed for my own good from the infinitely wise and loving hand of God, not only including but especially those things which I at the time I thought had been the greatest catastrophes.  I saw that my two greatest regrets when I died would be every moment which I had wasted not doing anything of value in the eyes of God, and all of the time and energy which I had wasted worrying about not being loved when every moment of my existence I was bathed in an infinite sea of love, although unaware of it.  I saw that the meaning and purpose of my life was to worship and serve my Lord and Master, in whose presence I found myself.  I wanted to know His name, so that I could worship Him properly, so that I could follow "His" religion.  I remember silently praying "Tell me your name.  I don't mind if You're Apollo, and I have to become a Roman pagan.  I don't mind if You're Krishna, and I have to become a Hindu.  I don't mind if You're Buddha, and I have to become a Buddhist.  As long as You're not Christ, and I have to become a Christian!" (Jewish readers might be able to identify with this deep-rooted aversion to Christianity, based on the mistaken belief that it was the "enemy" which lay behind two thousand years of persecution of the Jews.)"

God did not reveal himself. For the next year, Mr. Schoeman prayed to this 'unknown' God asking Him to identify Himself.

One year to the day ....

"A year to the day after the initial experience, I went to sleep after saying that prayer, and felt as though I was woken by a gentle hand on my shoulder, and escorted to a room where I was left alone with the most beautiful young woman I could imagine.  I knew without being told that she was the Blessed Virgin Mary.  I felt entirely awake (and my memory is as though I had been awake), although I was dreaming.  I remember my first reaction, standing there awed by her presence and grandeur, was wishing I knew at least the Hail Mary so that I could honor her!  She offered to answer any questions I had.  I remember thinking about what to ask, asking the questions, and her answers.  After speaking to me a while longer, the audience was ended.  When I woke the next morning I was hopelessly in love with the Blessed Virgin Mary, and I knew that the God I had met on the beach was Christ, and, and that all I wanted was to be as much of, and as good a, Christian as possible.  I still did not know anything about Christianity, nor the difference between the Catholic Church and any of the hundreds of Protestant denominations.  It took me another two years or so to find my way to the Catholic Church, guided by my love and reverence for the Blessed Virgin Mary."

This is the precisely what the Catholic Church intends when it honors Mary as 'co-redemptrix'. It was Mary who drew Roy Schoeman to her Son. Had it not been for Mary, Mr. Schoeman might be worshiping Krishna right now. Got it?

You can read the entire story at this link:

SCHOEMAN CONVERSION

469 posted on 07/15/2005 4:09:52 PM PDT by NYer ("Each person is meant to exist. Each person is God's own idea." - Pope Benedict XVI)
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To: NYer
I saw that my two greatest regrets when I died would be every moment which I had wasted not doing anything of value in the eyes of God, and all of the time and energy which I had wasted worrying about not being loved

Awesome. Just when I was thinking this thread was a waste of time.
554 posted on 07/15/2005 7:52:55 PM PDT by visualops (www.visualops.com)
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To: NYer

Coredemptrix, which means "Woman with the Redeemer" who gave the word that meaning? After reading the replies to the unintentional firestorm I created by speculating that the theology of coredemptrix may not be completely understood by most Catholics, based on the threads here I am convinced that my assumption was correct. ie:  Though many Catholics believe in the legitimacy of this title, it has not been defined as an article of faith.

 Mary cannot and does not redeem us by herself. What can she do to add to the finished work of Christ on the cross? Was his death not sufficient in and of itself to redeem the world? Is not salvation a gift from God and not of works? I must admit I am more confused now than I was before I started reading the various explanations for the theological concept of co redemption.

 Roy Schoeman, a Harvard Business School professional, Harvard, strike one, Professor, strike two, God did not reveal himself. For the next year, Mr. Schoeman prayed to this 'unknown' God asking Him to identify Himself. Interesting that this Harvard professor didn’t think to read the Bible. If you want to know God, the first place to start in my opinion would be the Bible. If you are a Muslim then read the Koran. If you are a Jew than read the Old Testament etc. Are not those sources primary?

 It was Mary who drew Roy Schoeman to her Son. John 14:6

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

697 posted on 07/17/2005 1:44:12 AM PDT by street_lawyer
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