Duma refuses to amend presidential election system (Russian term limit to stay)

rian.ru ^ | 1/07/2005 | RIA Novosti

[Destro]

Duma refuses to amend presidential election system

1/07/2005

MOSCOW, June 29 (RIA Novosti) - The State Duma (the lower chamber of the Russian parliament) rejected an amendment to the presidential election system Wednesday.

Only 32 deputies (226 votes were needed) voted for the amendment submitted by parliamentarian Alexander Moskalets (United Russia).

The law on presidential elections stipulates that an acting president who resigns before the end of his term is not allowed to run in the next elections.

Moskalets proposed lifting this restriction, which had already caused disputes in the Duma and media.

The media discussed this proposal that could allow the incumbent president to run for a third term.

In compliance with the Russian Constitution, a president can only be elected for two successive four-year terms. The second term of President Vladimir Putin expires in March 2008.

Vladimir Pligin, the chairman of the Duma's committee for constitutional legislation and state develoment, backed the chamber's decision and said that the amendment should be revised.

[Centurion2000]

Sounds like Putin will have to TAKE power if he wants to run the country after his terms.

[Destro]

Why are you people all hard for such a scenario -It is like you wet dream it - Putin, if he wants can run for prime minister after his term expires or wait 4 years and run for president again (the term limit is only for 2 consecutive terms). I know the new world is not as cool as the old world of the Cold War was - get used to it.

[Centurion2000]

I'm not. I really don't care which way he runs. And as ar as wanting the Cold War back? Not a chance.

Putin as Tsar does have a little bit of appeal since he would assume the executive branch for his country and start looking for long term solutions.

[Destro]

I don't think Putin wants to be a Czar - but he may want the institutions to be the Czars which can survive bad leaders. After Yeltsin few Russians trust individual politicians.

[Destro]

I don't think Putin wants to be a Czar - but he may want the institutions to be the Czars which can survive bad leaders. After Yeltsin few Russians trust individual politicians.

PS: I base this on Putin's pronouncment that he wants a "dictatorship of the law".

[GSlob]

According to the basic mechanisms of arbitrary power exercise, after the expiration of his term at the top he could continue existing only on his successor's sufferance, and might be better off settling in Lukashenko's Belarus or in China. And such sufferance would not include the possibility of return to power.

[Destro]

I don't see Russia operating under like either of those nations even if Putin never comes back into office. I think after Yeltsin was humilated by Clinton over Kosovo the military and the FSB decided that they will no longer allow the nation to be ruled in such a way. I tend to think of it as the Russan version of the Electoral College.

The easing out of Yeltsin (and the so called slide away from democracy that some Russian detractors mention) came out of what Clinton did in Kosovo as Chechnya was also heating up.

[GSlob]

You are right in not seeing Russia operating like China. The Chinese have shown themselves to be WAY more sophisticated and successful. And "easing out" [of Yeltsin] just serves to illustrate my point: Yeltsin exists on Putin's sufferance, with amnesty/legal immunity, pension etc. And what would be the limits of that sufferance if Yeltsin got himself an idea to try and get back in power? -Anything from an [alcohol-related] "accident" to a show trial.

[Destro]

You say 'show trail'. You know full well the trail could be super fair and Yeltsin would be found guilty. Yeltsin is guilty or to be more correct his family is guilty - the Kremlin would go after his crooked daughter.

Put you described an adversarial system. I think the current Russian system is an 'Freemason' like system where deference is given to members and the members look out for each other.

I think in this way Putin and those around him in the Kremlin are Russian patriots - they really do want what is best for Russia - but they don't think they can trust those outside of their clique to be good Russians. I think they use the term 'siloviki'(??) to describe this clique - I don't know if that is the correct spelling or the proper word for this group.

They are arguably the only group from the old USSR that actually had any sort of competency and 'Esprit De Corp.'

They were never true Communists because by the 70s the 'siloviki' who had to implement the policies knew what the old leadership refused to accept as true (even if deep down inside they knew it) that Communism did not work. They wanted to keep the integrity of the USSR but not keep the Communism/Marxist ideology.

[GSlob]

State trials are NEVER fair, much more so in the countries without the civil society and the rule of law with its independent judiciary. Even when there is the rule of law, one cannot be quite sure. I cannot remember even ONE court acquittal in a Russian state case, with the possible exception of the wrist slap given to anti-Gorbachev KeGeBuns after their failed coup attempt.
The "ideology" part of your post is incoherent. As Stalin once said "Marxism is not a dogma, but guidance to action". Ideology manifests itself in this action [and not in red banners and other suchlike symbols and slogans], i.e. in how people behave in socially important situations, toward one another and to their society. Properly speaking, the ideology IS the mental tuning-up to, and standardization for, such an action.
And in this sense those "siloviki" [your spelling was correct] are 200% communists through and through, even if they are brandishing three-colored banner instead of old monochromatic red.

[Destro]

You are incorrect in my opinion. Yeltsin's daughter and her family would be found guilty - what the state is doing is withholding trail as a way to keep Yeltsin in retirement.

You say the Siloviki are 200% Communist - but can offer no proof that they do what communists are supposed to do. The siloviki were the middle men of the old Soviet regime. Which leads me to conclude that your prejudice clouds your analytical abilities. We seem to agree up tp the point where you conclude the current system is "Stalinist" or that the siloviki are 'Stalinists' rather than functionaries that have taken over.

If I can be faniciful and use Orwell's 'Animal Farm' the old regime leadership was the pigs and the dogs were the silovoki or was that the horse? Whichever ones carried out the orders - I don't remember who was who anymore in the book. So the pigs ar egone leaving the middle managers or if you will the old enforcers to do the running of the farm but this time the farm animals have a choice/say.