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To: CHARLITE

Nice swipe at France.
Gratuitous.
And erroneous.
The US Constitution does not say "under God".
And the French Constitution, while proclaiming the doctrine of laicite (loosely, "secularism") does not exclude religion from public life. Indeed, the government pays the salaries of teachers in both religious and public schools. Americans do not have school vouchers yet, because of constitutional barriers raised against them. In France, effectively, there are universal vouchers. Also, the French state maintains all of the churches of France, on the grounds that they are historical sites. Lest one think that this imparts government control of the content of the Churches, that is not the case. Most French people are Catholic. The government of France does not control the Catholic church, and it does not interest itself in the business of the Catholic Church. It maintains the cathedrals because they are historical sites and tourist attractions, but "laicite" in no way requires the state to exclude the religious symbols or cult that is practiced in those churches.
The government simply does not involve itself in religion, but instead of having a system of tax deductions (and a lack of vouchers) it maintains the physical church buildings, and it pays teachers' salaries.

French national holidays include Christmas, Easter Monday, All Saints Day and the Assumption. Nobody seriously advocates changing any of this. And even if someone did, the only way that could be done would be act of Parliament, given that courts in France cannot order changes in law.

So, the swipe at France was not only gratuitous, it was about 180 degrees out. France is more protective of religion in a positive sense. Religion simply plays less role in politics and government, perhaps because it is left alone, and supported to the extent that is compatible with laicite, because it is recognized as a public good.


2 posted on 06/28/2005 10:31:02 PM PDT by Vicomte13 (Et alors?)
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To: Vicomte13

A very informative post, thank you, I was not aware of the details of the laws of France when it comes to religion.

Now, with that said - I'm not at all thrilled with your use of the word "cult" in reference to the Catholic Church.


6 posted on 06/28/2005 10:53:12 PM PDT by Gabz (My give-a-damn is busted.)
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To: Vicomte13
The US Constitution does not say "under God".

I think the reference was to the Declaration of Independence, no? Goes something like this:

IN CONGRESS, July 4, 1776.

The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America,

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights...

.

8 posted on 06/28/2005 11:20:36 PM PDT by ForGod'sSake (ABCNNBCBS: An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly.)
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