You ain't seen nothing yet (America's Christian Right)

The Economist ^ | 23 june 2005 | The Economist

[voletti]

THIS week, for the fourth year in a row, President George Bush broke from affairs of state to address the Southern Baptist Convention. He promised the strict evangelical group, which has 16m members, that he would work hard to ban gay marriage and abortion, and that their “family values” were his values, too.

In the 1960s, many liberal Americans thought they had banned religion from the public square for good. Yet nowadays the president, the secretary of state and the House speaker accept the evangelical label. A packed prayer breakfast takes place every Thursday in Congress. And liberals regularly contend that one of America's two great parties is bent on creating a theocracy—backed by a solid core of somewhere between a quarter and a third of the population.

Why is the religious right as powerful as it is? The question puzzles even Americans. Their country, as a whole, is not getting more religious. The gap between it and European countries has increased, but largely because of Europe's growing godlessness. Most Americans say that religion is very important (60%) or fairly important (26%) in their lives, but Karlyn Bowman, a polling analyst at the American Enterprise Institute, points out that the figures were 75% and 20% in 1952.

What has changed is, first, the make-up of Protestant America and, second, the realignment of religious America's politics. The generally liberal mainline churches have declined, while harder outfits like the Southern Baptists have spurted forward. White evangelicals, who see the Bible as the literal truth (or darned close to it), now make up 26% of the population.

It is not just a matter of numbers but of confidence. Born-again Christians are no longer rural hicks; they are richer and better educated than the average American.

[ForGod'sSake]

.

[My2Cents]

Lenin lurking around the corner.

[My2Cents]

Where are the Islamofascism comix for today?

[My2Cents]

[Vision]

Why is the religious right as powerful as it is? The question puzzles even Americans. Their country, as a whole, is not getting more religious. The gap between it and European countries has increased, but largely because of Europe's growing godlessness

This is where I tuned out

[My2Cents]

...although, not to exclude our Jewish cousins...

[af_vet_rr]

Outstanding comment. I still oppose gay marriage, but your points are well-taken

I still oppose it as well.

I just get irritated when I hear the drumbeaters go on about the evils of gay marriage, and I'm thinking their house could be burning down around them, and they would be more interested in a forest fire 2000 miles away.

It is a lot easier to paint the gay marriage issure as the root of all of the problems, than to face the facts that more and more heterosexuals are getting divorced, or just not getting married and instead living together (and even having children out of wedlock).

[My2Cents]

and I'm thinking their house could be burning down around them

This is usually the case. You're reminder and perspective are appreciated.

[don-o]

Protestants do not recognize the Pope.
Jews do not recognize Jesus.
Baptists do not recognize each other in the liquor store.

[television is just wrong]

Well he's got a lot of work to do.

[Freebird Forever]

He promised the strict evangelical group, which has 16m members, that he would work hard to ban gay marriage and abortion, and that their “family values” were his values, too.

Simple political pandering.

His speeches to muslims tell them exactly what they want to hear as well.

How many times has Bush stated that islam is a religion of peace?

~~nuff said.

[PJ-Comix]

Where are the Islamofascism comix for today?

Good question. As a matter of fact, I believe comix could be a GREAT educational tool for all sorts of history and other subjects.

[My2Cents]

We once gave our young nephew a large book of Bible stories in comic book form. It was actually pretty great.

[Free Baptist]

Alright, unfermented juice of the grape is referred to in the KJB. What words are used to refer to it? New wine is found in the cluster (Isaiah 65:8). New wine in that passage is unfermented grape juice, which is the wine you will suck from a fresh picked cluster of grapes.

[Free Baptist]

They were trying to discredit BOTH John and the Lord Jesus, the very same way liberals try to discredit honest people today. No matter what John or Jesus did, they would try to find some way to make it appear evil. Not eating and drinking (drinking what? ...it wouldn't much matter to the reprobate minds bringing on the attack) means someone is demon possessed, and drinking and eating means that someone must be a glutton and a drunkard. There wouldn't have to be a single drop of fermented wine in the batch for those reprobates to make such an attack on our Lord. You credit our Lord's enemies with being accurate and just in their words, but they were not.

Jesus was addressing the multitudes (Matt. 11:6), and he was specifically referring to the VIOLENT who take the kingdom by force. These would have been liars, just like the inmates at Gitmo lying about their mistreatment...trained to lie! The attitude of that generation of Jews is described in vv. 16, 17, and implies dishonest responses to truth and dishonest reactions to God's invitation to them to accept His mercies. VV. 18, 19 record FALSE accusations...it wouldn't matter what substance was or was not in the cup from which John didn't drink and from which Jesus did drink. It could have been Perier in Jesus' cup and they would have accused Him of being a wine-bibber.

[Free Baptist]

Anything to justify your desire to drink. You evidently have no desire to glorify God in your body and in your spirit which are God's (if you are in fact a Christian), and you evidently have very little concern about whether your desires and practices in this area might be a stumbling block to others.

Proverbs 20:1 -- "Wine is a MOCKER, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.

[onyx]

Vicksburg has 4 riverboat casinos with a fifth authorized to open. Here's a look at Vb's religious denominations:

http://www.churchangel.com/WEBMS/vicksburg.htm

[Free Baptist]

How do you suppose, then, that the KJB spoke of unfermented grape juice?

Honest people with regard to the Bible, and trying to walk after the Spirit of God are not inclined to ask the Scriptures for justification to drink alcoholic beverages. Christians have liberty of which they are instructed not to use for an occasion to the flesh (Galatians 5:13). "Social drinking," that desire to just have an occasion to have an alcohol-laced drink, for the Christian, would be an occasion to the flesh. What in the world would make a Christian want an alcohol-laced beverage? What would be the Christian's purpose? What is the purpose in our day of alcohol in a beverage? Alcohol is in the drink to give a buzz! If you don't want a buzz, why not drink plain grape juice (that wine that is found in a fresh cluster of grapes on a vine)? No, the drinker of alcohol wants a buzz! He goes that direction prompted by the FLESH, not by the Spirit of God.

We do have refrigeration today, and the supermarkets have 80 foot rows of things to drink that have no alcohol, including unfermented wine! For someone who claims to be a child of God, still having to have something laced with alcohol has nothing at all to do with natural necessity (no refrigeration, etc.), which makes that argument moot for the Christian today. The honest Christian will confess that if he needs alcohol-laced beverage, it is fleshly and worldly desire, not justified by any appeal to Christian "liberty."

William Jennings Bryan, when he was Woodrow Wilson's Secretary of State, was the guest of the Japanese admiral who defeated the Russian fleet in the Russian-Japanese War. The Admiral proposed a toast, and lifted a glass of liquor. Bryan lifted a glass of water. The admiral protested..."You must drink our special rice liquor on this occasion." Bryan replied, "Admiral, Sir, you won your battles on water, I'll drink to your health with water...the day you win a battle on liquor, I'll drink to your health with liquor." The Admiral's respect for Bryan jumped ten notches.

Where did Bryan get such wisdom? He didn't get it from trying to justify social (or diplomatic) drinking from the Scriptures. He got it From Heaven! Bryan never touched a drop of any alcoholic beverage in his superior life. And he strongly discouraged it in Wildon's state dinners. Bryan was one of the greatest men in American history, and had great positive influence upon both morality and spirituality in his day. He was known as a "Bible-literalist," and volunteered time to great Christian evangelistic crusades, speaking at the young peoples gatherings associated with such crusades.

[Robert_Paulson2]

dancing too...
and movies of any kind.
chewing gum.
any deck of cards game other than rook or the bull and bear.
quija boards.
music of the rock variety for sure.
or permutations and variations of any type thereof...
the denominational handbook in my library from the 60s, lists wearing of makeup as a sin of commission.
the wearing of stockings.
the shaving of the legs.

such folks of that and related denominations believe that 'christian rock' is satanic. that statues commemorating the lives and testimonies of the saints are idolatrous blasphemy... and to them, it's not an attack against the Catholics... they TRULY believe that any such thing, will damn them to hell.

Until the mid fifties, men and women, even married had to enter the church and sit on opposite sides of the sanctuary.

Swimming with members of the opposite sex, family or not, was considered a commision of sexual immorality and IN the family, mixed bathing was considered... you know... sexual abuse of the incestous kind.

that is way off the beam with the majority of catholics...
and today's evangelicals. But the fundamentalists are still out there... we just don't get a lot from them on the internet. Some of their close relatives however... do occasionally go on a tear about Ann Coulter's skirts.