An Autopsy Won't End It - (John Leo on the hypocrisy of Michael Schaivo and George Felos)

US NEWS.COM ^ | JUNE 27, 2005 | JOHN LEO

[DJ MacWoW]

I disagree with your reading comprehension, in that you concluded the court ordered Terri's death. They did not.

Then why the court order that she also not be given anything orally? And don't hand me the "She'd choke and die" crap. What would it matter since she was ordered to die? And yes, I believe choking to be kinder and quicker than drying her out for 13 days like a saltine.

[Spiff]

You know, the part that says a patient may refuse medical treatment?

Go read Judge Greer's death order. It did not say that medical treatment should be removed. It said that all hydration and nutrition should be stopped. It was a state-enforced death sentence, not a removal from life supporting medical equipment. Go read it.

[RobbyS]

One thing. Why no legal instrument? Many (most) states require. Not infallible, but better than letting judge be judge, jury and executor. Why not have a review board analogous to a pardon board in criminal cases. Law tends to be driven by process, but process is not an end in itself, which is why equity jurisdiction appeared. But equity is a "royal" power, and so there is no reason why it should NOT be vested in the executive. Texas gives the governor the power to stay' the pardon board the authoprity to pardon. Something like this to check the power of the courts when they get caught in a "loop," where the judicial process is not open to a different result.

[dennisw]

temper temper temper....

[Spiff]

But when delivered by medical staff, on doctor's orders, through an artificial, surgically implanted feeding tube, however, it becomes medical care.

A tube. A plastic spoon. A soda straw. What's the difference? The feeding port could have been maintained by and Terri fed by the Schindlers in their home. That's not medical care, not lifesaving, heroic medical care, requiring a medical professional.

[robertpaulsen]

"The way the partisan hacks in Washington pandered to your misinformed opinion of what the business of the national government should be was disconcerting."

Equally true for the "conservative" talk show hosts. I actually couldn't listen to them -- they sounded like AirAmerica.

[RobbyS]

States rights should not be regarded as absolute, except in a few cases. such as the right to maintain their borders.

[Spiff]

Because the extreme right to life fanatics like you insisted that morphine be injected into a "vegetable". The judge conceded, figuring it would do no harm.

Number one, prove that. Show me where the "extreme right to life fanatics" convinced the judge to order the morphine.

Second, what are your views on abortion?

[RobbyS]

Vegetable? We can do without such rhetoric.

[Spiff]

It's really none of your buisness though is it.

Well except for the fact that we have a monster wandering around.

Three monsters if you include Felos and Greer.

[Spiff]

Now, if you cannot find your source, I'll have to conclude that you're the liar.

Wrong answer. You're the one who said that "extreme fanatic pro-lifers" insisted upon the morphone. YOU prove what you said or YOU'RE the liar.

[veronica]

I don't care if people go "off-topic." It's just a website. :)

[robertpaulsen]

"Suicide, assisted suicide, and murder are not legitimate options for the profoundly disabled."

Be that as it may, Terri had the constitutional right to refuse medical treatment. That was the issue. Not suicide, not assisted suicide, not murder, not euthanasia.

Keep your eye on the ball, Spiff.

[Spiff]

I disagree with your reading comprehension, in that you concluded the court ordered Terri's death. They did not.

I'll say it again, go read Judge Greer's death order. It doesn't say that medical treatment be removed. It says that all hydration and nutrition should be ceased.

[Spiff]

Vegetable? We can do without such rhetoric.

I was quoting Mr. Paulsen. Bring it up with him. You can't miss him. He's the one cheering about the state killing Terri.

[robertpaulsen]

"Which then flies in the face of all those that say they don't want the government in a "personal" matter."

Many people on this board very much wanted to involve the government, at all levels, in this "personal" matter. Some wanted to call out the National Guard to storm the hospital!

This was not euthanasia, state sponsored or otherwise. This was the judicial system enforcing the state constitution, allowing a person to refuse medical treatment. Period.

You may argue that this wasn't Terri's wish. Fine. You may argue that a feeding tube isn't medical treatment. Fine.

But for those of us who agree with the judge's decision, they were.

[Admin Moderator]

Knock off the personal attack now!

[jwalsh07]

You don't understand the court order or the holding of the 2nd DCA, you don't understand the 5th Amendment (clue: it is not about the rights of prisoners, it is about the rights of persons) and you have no conception of powers and rights. You're hoplessly deluded into thinking that you are the "true conservative" for whatever reason. I suspect, however, if the State orders your death, you will be screaming to the high heavens for your Constitutional rights and federal review.

[Spiff]

Be that as it may, Terri had the constitutional right to refuse medical treatment. That was the issue. Not suicide, not assisted suicide, not murder, not euthanasia. Keep your eye on the ball, Spiff.

Did she have the constitutional right to go on a hunger strike and starve herself to death - to commit suicide via dehydration/starvation - without any intervention? Then, lacking such a "right", she could not have delegated it, through a living will or other document (in this case purely hearsay) to another person to carry out her wishes.