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To: Zionist Conspirator

you're right about what happened under Mao and Israel-China ties didn't really warm up until after Deng took over in the 80's. But still, history lesson is just that - Israelis appreciated what Chinese did for them in WWII and that's where the fundamental ties come from.

And, you're wrong -- China when it was fighting the Japanese was both, communists and nationalists. BOth side blame each other for fighting not as hard, though :) Communists won the civil war afterwards because the Nationalists lost popular support (it was pretty corrupt at the time)

Furthermore, i don't think Israel trust the US that much given our own wavering support for them from time to time. Every time a new president is elected, foreign policy changes. How can we conduct diplomacy when we don't have a consistent message?


117 posted on 06/15/2005 3:26:28 PM PDT by pganini
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To: pganini; BringBackMyHUAC; Alouette
you're right about what happened under Mao and Israel-China ties didn't really warm up until after Deng took over in the 80's. But still, history lesson is just that - Israelis appreciated what Chinese did for them in WWII and that's where the fundamental ties come from.

The problem is that the aid is not going to the Chinese who aided Jews during World War II but to the current PRC, CCP, and PLA. Can these entities be trusted, and is it even morally right for an Israeli government to have any dealings with them? Of course this is an issue of Halakhah and I am no poseq.

And, you're wrong -- China when it was fighting the Japanese was both, communists and nationalists. BOth side blame each other for fighting not as hard, though :) Communists won the civil war afterwards because the Nationalists lost popular support (it was pretty corrupt at the time)

True. Ironic, is it not, that the World Left, which so identifies with the forces that fought the Nazis (other than our own GI's apparently) seems to have completely forgiven the Japanese (except in those nations that suffered Japanese occupation) and the USSR remained on relatively friendly terms with the Japanese until 8/8/1945 when they suddenly declared war (abrogating the Molotov-Matsuoka Pact) and came sweeping through Manchuria. Soviet histories never even mentioned the Pacific part of World War II.

Furthermore, i don't think Israel trust the US that much given our own wavering support for them from time to time. Every time a new president is elected, foreign policy changes. How can we conduct diplomacy when we don't have a consistent message?

The point is not that Israel should trust the US (we've tied their hands behind their backs any number of times). The point is that Communist China is a Malkhut HaResha`im (kingdom of the wicked) that denies HaShem, the be-all and end-all of Jewish existence, and it may be a chillul HaShem (a desecration of G-d's Name) to support them. It certainly violates the principal of mar'it `ayin, giving the appearance of something evil.

As mad as I am at President Bush for his post-election reversal of everything he supposedly stood for during the previous four years, I really have no right to feel that way considering that I was never under any impression that he was a Hal Lindsay dispensationalist, as so many Fundamentalist Republicans assumed. Never trust a politician, especially a lame duck!

At any rate, Israel should put its trust in HaShem and not in any man, and its policies should reflect the Holiness of the Jewish nation. Of course the Israeli government's domestic positions (Temple Mount, expulsion of Jews) doesn't reflect this, so naturally their foreign policy isn't going to. But it is terribly short-sighted to sell military equipment to a "friendly" regime that is also friendly with a number of enemies. Not that he US has ever learned this lesson.

And I agree, Israeli support for Red China is no different than US support for Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria, Hamas, the PLO, Egypt, or any number of other nations that are deadly enemies of Israel.

It's too bad that China's old Nationalist government was so anti-Zionist. It became a natural outpost for Saudi-style anti-Israel propaganda and sentiment. The World Anti-Communist League (founded by Nationalist China and South Korea) might have been very different had the Kuomintang been friendly to the Zionists. As it was they were unremittingly hostile, opening up the WACL to the "anti-Communist" Arab world and to old European Nazis and "aryan" racialists as well (it got so bad at one time that the American section actually had to secede from the WACL).

118 posted on 06/15/2005 3:43:41 PM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (It's Shavu`ot! Ten Commandments monuments in every public space (to celebrate multiculturalism)!)
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