Understanding History: Slavery and the American South

EverVigilant.net ^ | 06/09/2005 | Lee R. Shelton IV

[RegulatorCountry]

"And a strong stomach."

A strong stomach is insufficient to withstand being gut shot and taken as a prisoner of war, I do know that.

[Non-Sequitur]

Youda thunk Grant would have learned this before Cold Harbor.

In fairness to Grant he had never tried an assault like the one at Cold Harbor before and never tried it again. Lee didn't seem to learn from his mistakes.

[smug]

I figured that even as slow as information moved in that time, battle histories would have made there way to the top brass. I am no smart man but I like to learn from the mistakes of others. The toll is less dear that way.

[Non-Sequitur]

I figured that even as slow as information moved in that time, battle histories would have made there way to the top brass.

Not really, no. The Civil War is the first conflict I'm aware of where a systematic attempt was made to catalog and document all dispatches and reports. And that was done post war.

[moehoward]

"Enumeration of powers is a difficult concept for some folks, apparently."

Specifically which, in your opinion?

Seems even the Court could not be consistent, supporting South Carolina's position in Kentucky v. Dennison. Many believe Justice Taney's ruling was meant to deny Lincoln the power to coerce states back into the union. Then in 1869 supporting the "perpetuity and indissolubility of the Union," in Texas v. White.

[moehoward]

>>>that the powers granted under the Constitution, being derived from the people of the United States may be resumed by them whensoever the same shall be perverted to their injury or oppression, and that every power not granted thereby remains with them and at their will<<<

Interesting.

[Ditto]

"...that the powers granted under the Constitution, being derived from the people of the United States may be resumed by them whensoever the same shall be perverted to their injury or oppression...

Curious minds would like to know exactly what Federal powers were perverted to injury and oppression in 1860-61.

[Ditto]

One wonders, though, how long it would have been before the national socialists in the north to think of a pretext for dismantling the limited government envisioned by the original Constitution. I guess it would have been ...probably until the 1930's when government action set off the depression...which resulted in more government action...which prolonged the depression...which resulted in more government action...the packing of the court...until eventually depression passed.

I'd remind you that although the "alpha-dog" National Socialist happened to be from the State of New York, the former Confederate States voted for him and supported him as a solid block through 4 terms. He never reached that level of support in the North. But then again, while FDR handed out taxpayer cash to his supporters, North and South, he never once tampered with Jim Crow.

And how about the tall, bombastic Nationational Socialist from Texas in the 1960s, or the little, mean, vindictive anti-American one from Georgia in the 1970s.

[Natural Law]

Slavery was an institution of the "landed gentry". It was not the main reason most Confederates, or Northerners fought.

[TexConfederate1861]

I don't prefer the word "rebellion", but yes...it wasn't justified.

[TexConfederate1861]

Sharpsburg is considered a draw. Lee withdrew into Virginia, McClellan failed to destroy his Army.

[Non-Sequitur]

Sharpsburg is considered a draw. Lee withdrew into Virginia, McClellan failed to destroy his Army.

Antietam spelled the end to Lee's first campaign in the North. He was forced to retreat. And in doing so the south lost any chance of European recognition. Antietam spelled the end of any slight chance the south ever had of winning their rebellion. It was a major defeat.

[TexConfederate1861]

Noni:

Making such a disrespectful remark about Lee is totally unlike you, and you should be ashamed. Regardless of what you may think, the majority of his ex-foes respected him, and gave him great eulogies when he passed away. Remember, this is the man that Lincoln thought highly enough of, that he offered him command of the Union Army.

[TexConfederate1861]

I blame the arrogance and pride of BOTH sides.

[Non-Sequitur]

Making such a disrespectful remark about Lee is totally unlike you, and you should be ashamed.

And should RegulatorCounty be ashamed of his remarks?

[TexConfederate1861]

That depends on your viewpoint. My point is that the states always retsined the right of secession.

[TexConfederate1861]

Sorry, but MANY historians disagree with you on that one.
(Except the Pansy twins : McPherson and the idiot that did the PBS "Civil War" Series)

[TexConfederate1861]

We aren't discussing him. And those other Generals are hardly the equal of Lee.

[Non-Sequitur]

We aren't discussing him. And those other Generals are hardly the equal of Lee.

Your double standard is showing. Something you and he have in common.

[Non-Sequitur]

Sorry, but MANY historians disagree with you on that one.

Which ones? The ones who say that Thomas Jackson was opposed to slavery? In one day Robert Lee lost any chance the south had for foreign recognition. No recognition meant that the slim chances the south had for winning their rebellion died. So in effect, the chance for confederate independence died on September 17, 1862. What bigger loss was there then that?