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To: oceanview
we've had this debate before, in order for that stat to be meaningful, you would have to:

- remove all government workers, because I'm only interested in how private sector workers are doing. government workers do not add to the tax base, and they have contracts with built in wage increases, their salaries never go down. I could also make the case that people who work in health care are also "part time" government workers, since so much of the $$$s spent on health care (and on their salaries) come from government (medicaid, medicare).

- I would also remove all workers making over $250K a year, I don't want to see their wage increases in those figures. The reason is that if you include them, you include the concentration effects of what is happening in industry with offshoring. When oracle sends 1000 $75K engineers from the US to India, their US executives get big bonuses, while their now unemployed US workers are likely taking lower wages. When the executives at a US furniture company send their manufacturing jobs to China, they also increase their compensation as a result, their laid off workers are working at Home Depot now. The stats mean nothing if those concentration effects are not excluded.

Show me what is happening to the stats with those two filters applied - I guarantee you that middle class private sector wages have fallen over the last 5 years.

For the private sector, various figures with constant dollars are doable, but it's hard for me to eliminate the highly compensated with the available information sources that I am familiar with.

But leaving the highly compensated included, here in 1982 dollars are average hourly earnings for the total private sector from 1977 up through this year. (Source: BLS Statistics Gateway [just enter "CES0500000049" for your series id to retrieve this particular table.])


Series Id:     CES0500000049
Seasonally Adjusted
Super Sector:  Total private
Industry:      Total private
NAICS Code:    N/A
Data Type:     AVERAGE HOURLY EARNINGS, 1982 DOLLARS
Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Annual
1977 8.61 8.60 8.61 8.62 8.62 8.62 8.62 8.63 8.63 8.69 8.68 8.67  
1978 8.69 8.70 8.69 8.72 8.68 8.69 8.67 8.67 8.66 8.65 8.64 8.64  
1979 8.63 8.59 8.57 8.46 8.45 8.41 8.37 8.34 8.32 8.27 8.24 8.22  
1980 8.10 8.08 8.04 7.99 7.96 7.95 7.98 7.99 7.97 7.97 7.96 7.93  
1981 7.93 7.90 7.92 7.91 7.91 7.90 7.85 7.86 7.83 7.83 7.85 7.83  
1982 7.88 7.87 7.91 7.89 7.88 7.81 7.81 7.84 7.84 7.82 7.85 7.92  
1983 7.95 7.99 7.96 7.94 7.95 7.95 7.97 7.90 7.94 7.97 7.96 7.96  
1984 7.96 7.94 7.98 8.00 7.97 7.99 7.99 7.92 7.92 7.90 7.92 7.94  
1985 7.92 7.91 7.91 7.91 7.90 7.91 7.91 7.93 7.94 7.90 7.89 7.90  
1986 7.85 7.90 7.96 7.99 7.99 7.96 7.97 7.98 7.95 7.96 7.98 7.96  
1987 7.92 7.92 7.90 7.87 7.88 7.84 7.83 7.85 7.83 7.83 7.85 7.85  
1988 7.84 7.82 7.82 7.82 7.84 7.82 7.80 7.78 7.79 7.80 7.80 7.79  
1989 7.79 7.79 7.76 7.74 7.69 7.70 7.72 7.73 7.74 7.76 7.73 7.73  
1990 7.69 7.70 7.70 7.70 7.71 7.70 7.68 7.63 7.60 7.57 7.56 7.56  
1991 7.56 7.57 7.57 7.59 7.58 7.59 7.60 7.59 7.59 7.58 7.57 7.57  
1992 7.56 7.57 7.57 7.56 7.56 7.55 7.54 7.55 7.53 7.53 7.53 7.52  
1993 7.53 7.52 7.55 7.53 7.53 7.52 7.53 7.53 7.54 7.52 7.53 7.53  
1994 7.54 7.56 7.54 7.55 7.55 7.53 7.52 7.50 7.50 7.53 7.52 7.52  
1995 7.51 7.52 7.52 7.51 7.50 7.52 7.54 7.54 7.55 7.55 7.56 7.55  
1996 7.55 7.54 7.53 7.54 7.54 7.56 7.56 7.58 7.58 7.57 7.58 7.58  
1997 7.59 7.60 7.63 7.64 7.67 7.67 7.68 7.71 7.70 7.74 7.76 7.78  
1998 7.79 7.83 7.86 7.88 7.88 7.88 7.88 7.92 7.93 7.93 7.94 7.94  
1999 7.95 7.98 8.00 7.98 8.00 8.02 8.01 8.01 8.00 8.00 8.00 8.00  
2000 8.02 8.01 7.98 8.03 8.03 8.01 8.02 8.04 8.03 8.05 8.07 8.07  
2001 8.03 8.06 8.09 8.08 8.06 8.07 8.10 8.13 8.11 8.16 8.20 8.23  
2002 8.22 8.23 8.21 8.18 8.21 8.23 8.24 8.23 8.25 8.26 8.26 8.29  
2003 8.26 8.25 8.21 8.23 8.28 8.29 8.31 8.28 8.25 8.27 8.31 8.29  
2004 8.27 8.25 8.23 8.24 8.21 8.20 8.23 8.25 8.25 8.22 8.21 8.23  
2005 8.24 8.22 8.19 8.16(p)                  
p : preliminary

And here is the employment cost index for wages and salaries over roughly the same time period. The constant dollars are based on 1989=100, and are deflated by the CPI. (Source: Table 6 from the current Employment Cost Index report from the BLS.)

TABLE 6. EMPLOYMENT COST INDEX (WAGES AND SALARIES ONLY), PRIVATE INDUSTRY WORKERS(1)

(Constant dollars, not seasonally adjusted)
                                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                          
                                               Indexes (June 1989=100)                           Percent Changes for                      
                                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                          
             Series and year                                                       3 months ended--               12 months ended--       
                                             Mar.    Jun.    Sep.    Dec.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                          
                                                                             Mar.    Jun.    Sep.    Dec.    Mar.    Jun.    Sep.    Dec. 
                                                                                                                                          
Private industry workers(1):                                                                                                              
     1975.................................    -       -     102.3   102.6     -       -       -       0.3     -       -       -       -   
                                                                                                                                          
     1976.................................  103.7   103.8   103.8   104.9     1.0     0.1     0.1     1.0     -       -       1.5     2.2 
     1977.................................  104.1   103.9   104.5   105.1     -.8     -.2      .6      .6     0.4     0.1      .6      .2 
     1978.................................  104.9   104.1   104.1   103.8     -.2     -.8      .0     -.4      .8      .2     -.3    -1.3 
     1979.................................  102.6   101.1   100.0    99.5    -1.1    -1.4    -1.1     -.5    -2.2    -2.9    -4.0    -4.1 
     1980.................................   97.6    96.5    97.2    96.5    -1.9    -1.1      .7     -.7    -4.9    -4.6    -2.8    -3.0 
                                                                                                                                          
     1981.................................   96.6    96.3    95.5    96.4      .1     -.3     -.9      .9    -1.0     -.2    -1.8     -.1 
     1982.................................   97.8    96.3    97.2    98.7     1.5    -1.5      .9     1.5     1.3      .0     1.8     2.4 
     1983.................................   99.5    99.0    99.2    99.7      .8     -.5      .2      .5     1.7     2.8     2.0     1.1 
     1984.................................   99.7    99.4    99.0    99.9     -.1     -.2     -.4      .9      .2      .4     -.2      .2 
     1985.................................  100.1   100.0   100.6   100.3      .1     -.1      .6     -.4      .4      .6     1.6      .3 
                                                                                                                                          
     1986.................................  101.7   101.9   102.0   102.3     1.5      .1      .1      .3     1.7     1.9     1.4     2.1 
     1987.................................  101.8   101.2   100.9   101.2     -.5     -.6     -.3      .3      .1     -.6    -1.1    -1.1 
     1988.................................  101.2   101.1   100.5   100.9      .0     -.1     -.6      .4     -.6     -.2     -.4     -.3 
     1989.................................  100.5   100.0   100.5   100.4     -.5     -.5      .5     -.1     -.7    -1.1      .0     -.5 
     1990.................................   99.5    99.8    98.6    98.4     -.9      .3    -1.3     -.2     -.9     -.2    -1.9    -2.0 
                                                                                                                                          
     1991.................................   98.6    98.9    98.9    99.0      .2      .3     -.1      .1     -.9     -.9      .3      .6 
     1992.................................   98.8    98.8    98.5    98.7     -.2      .0     -.2      .2      .2     -.1     -.3     -.3 
     1993.................................   98.4    98.5    99.0    99.1     -.3      .1      .5      .1     -.4     -.3      .4      .3 
     1994.................................   98.8    99.0    98.9    99.2     -.3      .2     -.1      .3      .4      .5      .0      .2 
     1995.................................   98.9    98.9    99.2    99.5     -.4      .0      .3      .4      .0     -.2      .2      .3 
                                                                                                                                          
     1996.................................   99.2    99.5    99.5    99.6     -.4      .3      .0      .1      .3      .6      .3      .1 
     1997.................................   99.7   100.4   100.9   101.8      .1      .7      .4      .9      .6      .9     1.4     2.2 
     1998.................................  102.3   102.7   103.6   104.0      .5      .4      .9      .4     2.6     2.3     2.7     2.2 
     1999.................................  103.9   104.3   104.2   104.9     -.2      .4     -.1      .6     1.5     1.6      .6      .8 
     2000.................................  104.3   104.7   104.9   105.3     -.5      .3      .2      .4      .4      .3      .6      .5 
                                                                                                                                          
     2001.................................  105.2   105.2   105.9   107.7     -.1      .0      .6     1.7      .9      .5      .9     2.2 
     2002.................................  107.4   107.8   107.6   108.0     -.3      .4     -.2      .4     2.0     2.5     1.7      .4 
     2003.................................  107.3   108.4   108.4   109.3     -.7     1.0      .0      .9      .0      .5      .7     1.1 
     2004.................................  108.2   107.6   108.4   108.4    -1.0     -.5      .7      .0      .8     -.7      .1     -.8 
     2005.................................  107.5     -       -       -       -.8     -       -       -       -.7     -       -       -   
                                                                                                                                          
 

253 posted on 06/08/2005 5:27:19 PM PDT by snowsislander
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To: snowsislander

Thanks for the info. I don't know what he'll find to complain about now.


258 posted on 06/08/2005 6:15:46 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (If you agree with Karl Marx, the AFL-CIO and E.P.I. please stop calling yourself a conservative!!)
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To: snowsislander

From your table, it looks like wages went down from 1977 to 2005, where is all that "economic growth" that we have been told we were having? If wages went down from 1977 to now, and taxes went up in that same time frame, then we are worse off?


283 posted on 06/08/2005 8:57:00 PM PDT by SandyB
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