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To: JohnnyZ
But I'm sure you know that and you are just making a point to attack Catholics on FR. Nice guy.

I'm not attacking any Catholics, most especially those on FR.

But the truth is that the Catholic Senators I cited are recognized and celebrated in their communities as Catholics, are returned to office over and over again by large Catholic majorities, and as much as you and others say "they aren't real Catholics", if they weren't, they'd be tossed out.

It's not as if they were Unitarians-if their bishop declared them out of communion with him, they would not be real Catholics, but since no bishop has done this, I challenge your assertion that they are not real Catholics.

When the Church, not you, puts them out, they will cease to be real Catholics, until then, they're as real as real can be.

49 posted on 05/29/2005 2:33:51 PM PDT by Jim Noble (Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God)
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To: Jim Noble
Semantics and hand-waving.

the Catholic Senators I cited are recognized and celebrated in their communities as Catholics

But are they?

are returned to office over and over again by large Catholic majorities

I'm sure you have exit polling numbers for each of those senators

as much as you and others say "they aren't real Catholics", if they weren't, they'd be tossed out.

What makes you think that?

When the Church, not you, puts them out, they will cease to be real Catholics, until then, they're as real as real can be.

If you're talking about excommunication, public declarations thereof are extremely rare. However, actual instances of it in the eyes of God are common. Then, as I mentioned, there is denial of Catholic beliefs. Call "Catholics" who don't believe Catholic truths heterodox or whatever you want, that is what people typically mean by "not real Catholics".

To say that terminology is false is just obstinacy in defense of those who deny Catholic teaching.

50 posted on 05/29/2005 2:56:12 PM PDT by JohnnyZ (Defeat Pat DeWine, RINO Mike DeWine's son! Tom Brinkman for Congress http://www.gobrinkman.com/)
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To: Jim Noble
Archbishop William Levada ON CATHOLIC POLITICIANS: "There may be a legitimate diversity of opinion even among Catholics about waging war and applying the death penalty, but not with regard to abortion and euthanasia. ... A Catholic, to be in full communion with the faith of the Church, must accept this teaching about the evil of abortion and euthanasia." - paper to U.S. bishops' conference, June 2004.

Those "Catholic" Senators you keep mentioning are not "in full communion with the faith of the Church".

56 posted on 05/29/2005 6:33:56 PM PDT by JohnnyZ (Defeat Pat DeWine, RINO Mike DeWine's son! Tom Brinkman for Congress http://www.gobrinkman.com/)
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