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To: cyborg

"Oral" meaning, G-d, Blessed is He, taught certain laws to Moses versus writing them down. this is the same process we all went through in school, (those that went to school, not sure everyone in this thread did) that is text book and class instruction to understand a subject. the Bible would have been too large to handle had all the implementation been written down. Sjackson is quite correct to say kindling a flame is a Torah/Bible prohibition on Sabbath. The prohibitions themselves where not clearly delineated in the text are based upon the necessary activities needed to build the tabernacle. The lessons are primarily found in Exodus where the instructions for building the Tabernacle are found and where the constant refrain is also found, {paraphrasing} "but do not do this on Sabbath". Therefore, even the very act of building the dwelling for G-d to reside with the Jews in the wilderness and where He would meet with Moses to give instruction, as important as this task was, does not override Sabbath restrictions.

Sabbath restrictions are to remember that in 6 days G-d created the Heavens and the Earth. He stopped creating on the 7th day. We too are commanded to stop all "creative" activity on the 7th day (which also happens to be the day called Saturday thanks to the Romans and not Sunday). The basis of all these laws restricting actions on Sabbath is to keep Jews from doing creative acts like our G-d, the creator of the universe did on the Sabbath.


55 posted on 05/17/2005 1:21:16 PM PDT by APRPEH (genocide and protection of the establishment are core priorities of the UN)
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To: APRPEH

What's the difference between the Torah and Talmud? Isn't the talmud supposed to be a further explanation of the Torah and especially about things like this thread topic?


59 posted on 05/17/2005 1:23:31 PM PDT by cyborg (Serving fresh, hot Anti-opus since 18 April 2005)
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To: All

I need some answers.

What I don't understand is if one believes there is a good reason for the Sabbath restrictions, why does one dream up ways to follow the technicality of the law but not the spirit? Having a machine do the prohibited acts for a person seems like cheating.

It is like building a machine that wishes your wife happy birthday and happy anniversay, sends her cards and flowers. Technically, we are showing her we love her, but is she really impressed? It also reminds me of people I have seen at cemetaries who take flowers from someone else's grave to put on the grave of a loved one. If the loved one is watching from the hereafter, do they think, "Oh, he really must love me!"

Is God happy that people are clever and have figured out ways around the prohibitions or does He say, "Dang, tricky little devils! I never thought they would come up with that idea! I should have worded it a bit tighter."

Is the spirit of the law the important thing or is it just the law? I would think if it were the former, none of these crazy gadgets would exist. If it is the latter, why even bother following the law if it has no "spirit" behind it?

Could I make a machine that would pull the trigger of a gun and have it kill someone I don't like and get away with it? Would God say, "Alright! Good one! You aren't guilty. The machine killed the guy!"

Someone please explain.

From what I know about Amish in NE Ohio, they can use machinery that is not fixed in place. A mobile sawmill is OK, but you can't bolt it down. You can't have a phone, but you can have a neighbor make your calls for you. (Tricky!) I think they can use some machinery to help pay off the mortgage, but once the bills are gone, so is the machinery.

I also think these are decided by the local bishops and probably vary from place to place. But again, if you are shunning a lifestyle, it seems like cheating to still take advantage of certain of its benefits. They can't own a car, but I can drive them to work. They can't own a car, but they can get a job driving a car or a truck or a taxi for a non-Amish company. Some of those taxis are used to pick up Amish people and take them to work. What a wonderfully convoluted way to beat the law! They can get a job working in a factory using all kinds of electrical machinery to make a living. Hmmm. Sounds like cheating again.

Again, what is the purpose of obeying the law? To show obedience or respect to God by following the spirit of the law or is it just to fulfill the law because it is a law? If I were God, (I can't put words into His mouth) I might have a warmer feeling toward those who are not trying to be tricky.

But I imagine God doesn't work that way. Wouldn't it be funny if, when we die, He says, "You dummy! You actually think I wanted you to do those stupid things and follow those stupid laws? I was hoping you would use your brains and figure out some loopholes to get around them! What a moron! I am going to reincarnate you as a platypus. Get thee hence!"


181 posted on 05/17/2005 3:10:14 PM PDT by Right Wing Assault ("..this administration is planning a 'Right Wing Assault' on values and ideals.." - John Kerry)
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