Court tosses conviction of man who endorsed Bush's death

Associated Press via MercuryNews ^ | Fri, Apr. 08, 2005 | DAVID KRAVETS

[mdittmar]

Mailing a letter to the White House supporting President Bush's death at the hands of terrorists is not illegal, a federal appeals court ruled Friday.

The decision overturns the conviction and 18-month sentence given last year to an Oregon inmate who sent a rambling, poorly written letter to the president. It read, in part, "You will die too George W Bush real Soon they Promised That you would Long Live Bin Laden."

[Semper911]

it appears that the court is right.

I believe you are correct.

[muawiyah]

Seems to me that the intent of Congress was quite clear and what we have here is a court declaring the intent is BS.

Time for the Executive to round these AlQaida sympathizers up and toss them in the slammer for the duration.

9th Circuit needed reorganized, and new members anyway.

The precedent for doing this sort of thing was set by President Wilson in WWI.

[muawiyah]

The court in this case is splitting hairs so they can send a message of the purest hate to "W". These guys are too dangerous for this country to allow them to run loose.

[kingattax]

unfortunately, you make a good point

[John Valentine]

It appears to me that the guy didn't make a direct threat.

This is a matter of fact finding. Presumably that lower court determined that this was indeed a threat under the law.

It is my understanding that the findings of fact of lower courts are not subject to judicial review.

Therefore, without reading the appellate opinion, I have to believe that it was not based on finding that the language was NOT a threat, but on some other flimsy, legalistic grounds.

[cripplecreek]

You may be right but I'm just looking at the bare minimum of facts that are available.

[kingattax]

read post 14 again.. the law says you either make the threat yourself OR post something in the mail that contains ANY threat. read it carefully again.

the appellate court ISNT right IMO

[Arthalion]

Simple. He didn't say that he wanted to kill Bush, he implied that he was sure, and hoping, that Al Queda would do it.

You can legally say that you hope the president dies. You can legally say that you hope that X kills the president. You can legally wish all of the ill will you want on the president. What you can NOT do is say "I'm going to threaten|hurt|kill the president". In fact, people have been convicted of simply saying "I WANT to threaten|hurt|kill the president", even when there is no actual evidence of a plot, and the intent is debatable.

It's a fine line, but a line just the same. If wishing ill on the president were illegal, half of the people on this board would have been imprisoned during the Clinton years :)

[Mr Ramsbotham]

If everyone in the country who endorses Bush's death got 18 months, there wouldn't be a Democrat on the streets.

[swilhelm73]

Now if this had been sent to Clinton, you could throw away the key on this guy. But since it is a conservative nothing is out of bounds.

As we found out, saying "you suck" to Bill Clinton is enough to get one arrested.

[Arthalion]

This is a matter of fact finding. Presumably that lower court determined that this was indeed a threat under the law.

Legally, the only way a threat can be proven under the law, if it wasn't made directly (example: "I am going to kill you"), would be for the prosecution to prove that the accused had some ability to make the threat a reality. In this case, the guy stating his joy that Al Queda is going to kill Bush doesn't qualify as a direct threat (unless he's an Al Queda operative). Without that, the prosecution would have to show that he could somehow influence Al Queda's ability or willingness to kill the president.

The guy's a slimeball, but the judgement is probably correct.

[CyberAnt]

It says the guy was an Oregon inmate.

I wonder why he was in jail ..?? That might have been a factor.

[SendShaqtoIraq]

I guess technically it wasn't a threat. It was just a wish.

[mdittmar]

Robbery.

[SendShaqtoIraq]

"If everyone in the country who endorses Bush's death got 18 months, there wouldn't be a Democrat on the streets."

And the downside would be?

[CyberAnt]

I should have known - the 9th CIRCUS strikes again.

[rdcorso]

It looks like the judges let him off because he was a stupid illiterate moron.This is one case where brain damage or the lack of a brain worked in someones favor.

[Socratic]

"This is one case where brain damage or the lack of a brain worked in someones favor."

So why doesn't it ever work for me? (Pouting away into the distance).

[thoughtomator]

I remember that vaguely... who was it who got arrested for that, again?

[John Valentine]

I don't argue that probably this wasn't a bonafide threat. I think that you are right and the ultimate result is probably correct.

I'm just don't see how the appeals court could have overturned the trial court on this point, as it is not a matter of law.