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To: chronic_loser
Although I am not sure what you mean by "in a major way" I am sure you would have to admit all of Newtonian Physics have "failed" when you move down to a subatomic level.

Since I wrote the sentence you are responding to, let me explain. I was actually thinking of Newton when I inserted the phrase "major way." My writing isn't always clear when I'm in a hurry, but I was thinking that Newton still works perfectly well within a wide range of parameters. It certainly works perfectly within the range of what we can experience without instruments.

Good theories do not get proven wrong. They just get assigned or limited to a range of conditions.

240 posted on 04/07/2005 5:35:32 AM PDT by js1138 (There are 10 kinds of people: those who read binary, and those who don't.)
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To: js1138

"Good theories do not get proven wrong. They just get assigned or limited to a range of conditions."

Right.
Somebody else mentioned Heisenbergian Uncertainty and Einsteinian Relativity.

Both of those things are completely false, untrue, when you are talking about a car accident in an intersection. There is no relativistic effect, and there is no uncertainty. Newtonian physics describe the car crash to a tee. Heisenbergian Uncertainty completely fails to explain the car crash...in fact, it might lead you to erroneously believe that one car could pass right through the other with no damage. But that, in fact, is completely impossible. Heisenberg works for subatomic particles under study at high energy. It is completely wrong for a Buick hitting a Ford. Newton, on the other hand, is completely right for the Buick hitting the Ford.

If both of them were approaching the speed of light, Heisenberg would still fail completely to describe anything.
Newton would still tell you what would happen when the one smacked the other.
But Einstein would chime in that the cars MIGHT miss each other because they each got so small as they approached light speed that more space was opened up so that maybe one could squeak past the other.

A classic mental error is to believe that the newer theory, which describes something at the fringes of observation (Heisenberg, for example) supersedes everything else.
Thus, we have folks saying, and really believing that, theoretically, somebody could walk right through a wall, or that my breakfast fork could simply rise from the Earth and pass out of the gravitational field..."anything is possible"..."theoretically".

Of course, the "theory" that thinks that Heisenberg and Einstein say that, or combined, somehow say that, is just a completely misunderstanding about the very limited and special cases, from our perspective, that Einstein and Heisenberg were speaking of.

What, in the real world, approaches the speed of light?
Nothing.
Everything in our world is at Newtonian speeds, or actually AT the speed of light. We don't get a little bit shorter when we speed up from 45 to 50 miles per hour. And we don't have a "wavelength" either, even though we can plug our numbers into a formula which will give us a "wavelength" for each of us based on our mass.

What, in the world outside of the supercollider and high energy physics lab, behaves uncertainly?
This is trickier.
Strict determinists would probably say "Nothing" and assert Newton. But if you really think about what entropy is and does, it's essentially a randomizer for things working at Newtonian speeds and sizes.

Nevertheless, even entropic "uncertainty" (I am coining an uncomfortable phrase) is bounded. It does not, and CANNOT (ever) literally rain "cats and dogs" unless (a) God intervenes directly - then anything is possible, but we aren't dealing with the laws of Physics at that point but the legislator who, like a US Judge, can basically do anything he wants and everybody has to obey, or (b) a tornado is passing by a pet store.


244 posted on 04/07/2005 6:48:04 AM PDT by Vicomte13 (Et alors?)
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