Posted on 03/21/2005 9:49:25 AM PST by MisterRepublican
CARBONDALE -- On the dance floor at Gatsby's II, a popular bar at Southern Illinois University in Carbondale, a tall brunette drinks beer from a plastic pitcher while she grinds her backside into a man's body.
A silver disco ball hangs overhead while a blond woman in a pink, pleated miniskirt writhes on her partner's leg.
A girl notices that her boyfriend's attention is wandering. With a manicured hand, she grabs his face and plants a Hollywood-worthy kiss on his mouth.
On this sticky dance floor, littered with plastic cups and packed with gyrating bodies, women are the hunters as much as the hunted.
Traditional stereotypes dictate that men want sex, and women crave love. But, on today's college campuses, students say those gender lines are blurrier than a pair of beer goggles.
When a University of Illinois sorority girl observed over lunch at a Champaign cafe that "guys aren't looking for love," her friend chimed in: "I don't think we can blame it on the guys. I'm not looking for love, either."
Girls are just as bad as boys now," another woman said.
"To guys, [sex is] still like scoring," said author Tom Wolfe, who spent two years on college campuses researching his new novel. "The strange part is that it's become that for girls, too. They'll say, 'I scored Jack last night . . . finally!'''
A federal government survey of 4,600 college students found that slightly more male than female undergrads are virgins.
(Excerpt) Read more at suntimes.com ...
himbo
Yes. Will a life of virtue make a person happier than a life of vice? Is Mother Theresa really happier than Scott Peterson, or merely subjectively happier?
Plus, delayed gratification (if they believe living moral life is the best gratification) is not most people's forte.
True. Does this invalidate the point, that a life of virtue will make one happier than a life of vice?
Americans want fun and they want it now.
Are they even subjectively happy?
Because the intellect is the greatest human power
for real?
In essence. You can't will anything unless you first know it. We know things through the intellect.
Nazi Germany was the most intellectually and academically advanced country of its time... so much for intellectual powers.
The abuse of a power doesn't negate its goodness per se.
That's crazy talk, there's plenty of evidence for it. Virtually all cervical cancer (at least 98%, maybe 100%) is caused by human papilloma virus, a very, very common STD. (50% of sexually active teenage girls have it, and most don't even know it.) Is cancer not "material damage"?
Condoms have ZERO proven effectiveness in stopping the transmission of HPV, because it's transmitted by skin-to-skin contact, not through semen. And it's perfectly happy to be transmitted by oral sex, too.
I already mentioned that chlamydia causes PID, which causes infertility. Condoms reduce, but certainly don't eliminate the risk of gettin chlamydia -- and (as the article indicates) these college students aren't using condoms anyway. Practically nobody uses them for oral sex, which, again transmits chlamydia just fine. Is infertility not "material damage"?
Plenty of evidence, too, that promiscuous people have more trouble forming stable marriages. That doesn't mean that none do, just that they're more likely to have trouble.
You are saying some very false and dangerous things on this thread.
2. HPV, because it's transmitted by skin-to-skin contact
then how not sleeping around will prevent one from contracting it?
3. these college students aren't using condoms anyway - aha! so, the problem is not lack of modesty, but failure to use condoms. :)
Plenty of evidence, too, that promiscuous people have more trouble forming stable marriages. That doesn't mean that none do, just that they're more likely to have trouble.
again, who said they are interested in marriage? who said they are willing to sacrifice their idea of exciting adventurous life for your idea of happy marriage? People don't wake up one day and decide they want to be happily married; usually something from the beginning is hard-wired in their heart (not brain)
You are saying some very false and dangerous things on this thread.
no, just realistic. I plan to be just as honest with my daughter, when she grows up: I will present her all common speculations, both supporting my stance and negating it, and my opinions about them and the real logic behind all this. Because if I don't, she will bring me some newest junk study citing that more sexually experienced women please their husbands better or something like that, and that would give her license to go wild?
I actually need to work. Otherwise, there will be hard evidence of my ended career :)
No - on this thread!
Does this invalidate the point, that a life of virtue will make one happier than a life of vice?
Only for those for whom virtue is a value.
The abuse of a power doesn't negate its goodness per se.
it's not that - just cult of intellect is what dangerous.
Did Scott Peterson ever aspired to be like Mother Theresa? I can write a huge and interesting essay here about how he feels and thinks...
Or you could answer the question. Is he really happier than Mother Theresa?
Does this invalidate the point, that a life of virtue will make one happier than a life of vice?
Only for those for whom virtue is a value.
So people who lead lives of vice can be objectively as happy as people who lead lives of virtue?
Members of the mafia are objectively as happy as the Sisters of Charity?
You are right. Nothing has changed since I was in college in the 80s. There werem and still are, plenty of female and male whores with the morals of a 60s rock star.
Reflecting on how it could work, financially ... say you have your young man. At 18 he gets a job, while still living at his parents' home. He can save the majority of his pay for his future expenses and/or education. His parents have also saved money for his college expenses.
Five or six years later, he's 23 or 24, meets nice girl, 20 years old, gets married. The girl has been living at home attending community college, has associate's degree in something practical :-). Now young man applies for college, knowing what he wants to study. Maybe he's got some CC transfer credits for the basics. His savings plus his parents' savings plus financial aid should be more than adequate to cover tuition, books, and a reasonable standard of living for himself, wife, and potential child. (Health insurance through the university? Health savings account? Not sure on that.)
He can be a full time student, just as many 18-23 year-olds are. Even more easily, because they've been earning interest on the savings longer. Wife can hold a job or be a student, as well, if she's not immediately having a child. If they do have children, maybe she can work from home - taxes, computer programming, sales, babysitting etc. - if they think it's worth the effort.
It seems to me that, among other benefits, the long-term financial outcome would be improved, because the couple would be motivated to be financially responsible from their earliest years of earning. Many young people spend the majority of their pay on things of no lasting value during their single years, and then start out their marriage with both debt and feckless habits.
Opinions?
There would be advantages to living at home. To be completely politically incorrect, I think this would have more value for women than men. Why? Ideally, a man should be the primary breadwinner in the household. A man needs to develop good work habits early. Living away from home would motivate a young man to increase his earning power, at least versus living at home. OTOH, living away from home can promote vice.
The priorities are different for women. A young woman should be planning on running a household as her primary duty. Living at home would serve two ends. It would help to preserve her virtue and reputation; and she would be able to pursue an education, save for a downpayment on a house, pursue a career, or any combination of the three.
I believe that the best thing for both young men and women is to begin working as early as possible. It's the best remedy for head-in-the-clouds disease.
Certainly helps! On the other hand, earning money, but not having to pay bills, promotes irresponsibility.
Cause you think sex is dirty?
That's one reason for booting them out of the house 8-)
Marriage and childbearing used to be common in the mid to late teens. Now it's mid to late twenties. You're a bit disingenuous to expect adults to keep the sex genie in the bottle for an additional decade. The "virgins at the alter" is no longer a valid relationship model for many.
remove the word "objectively". I can't answer any happiness-related question "objectively": everyone's idea of what's good is different, you can only evaluate happy/unhappy, right/wrong based on your set of beliefs.
Subjectively, yeah, S.Peterson could be feeling just as happy if not happier than Mother Theresa, at least until he got arrested. He operates on his level, Mother Theresa - on hers. If you're trying to say, that it's impossible to be happy without being moral, then again i will say everyone's idea of happiness is different.
True.
Of all the "poor youthful choices" there are to regret, what number would you assign to "meaningless tryst[s]"? I mean you've got murder, stealing, fighting with the Taliban in Afghanistan, becoming a communist, burning down a house, having an abortion, poor eating habits, not exercising, taking up smoking, getting hooked on a daytime soap, flunking out of college, speeding, wearing stripes with plaids, etc., etc.
Tut-tutters and tsk-tskers wear people out with their endless preaching about nits.
She is either awfully stupid or awfully repulsive.
I don't find her so.
You sound like someone rationalizing past sins.
Anyone who's been in a relationship knows that there's no such thing as "meaningless trysts."
You are really tiring with your BS and your lies. I knew NO "gals" who I could call up and get sex from. ZERO. I'll bet there are a lot of guys here who would say the same thing.
P.S., you're "double standard" nonsense is just that. I doubt most would see it as anything other than you attempting to justify yourself.
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