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Was Einstein right when he said he was wrong?
PhysOrg.com ^ | 16 March 2005 | Staff

Posted on 03/16/2005 11:59:50 AM PST by PatrickHenry

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To: PatrickHenry
percent comprises ordinary matter, those quarks, protons, neutrons and electrons that we and the galaxies are made of.

It sounds as though those quarks, protons, neutrons and electrons are nothing more than impurities contaminating the universe from its intended form. Maybe the perfect conditions for our existence occurred by accident or unintentionally. Maybe, we are nothing more than lucky, and maybe we will be corrected out of existence. Maybe I'm just crazy! lol
21 posted on 03/16/2005 12:30:04 PM PST by TheForceOfOne
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To: PatrickHenry

"Whether Einstein was right when he first introduced the cosmological constant, or whether he was right when he later refuted the idea..."

Einstein was right either way, then.


22 posted on 03/16/2005 12:31:19 PM PST by SMARTY
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To: DannyTN

> that expansion either occurred in the past or continues to occur is not too much of a surprise...

Not to someone who can say that, no matter what happens either way, that his book of vague sayings covers it all.


23 posted on 03/16/2005 12:32:18 PM PST by orionblamblam ("You're the poster boy for what ID would turn out if it were taught in our schools." VadeRetro)
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To: PatrickHenry

In my mind, one of the unobservables amid the reality of the universe is "what existed before."

Assuming one subscribes to the theory of the big bang, the logical assumption is that matter would continue to expand outward from the initial singularity until inertia was bled off by gravitational attraction, and the whole of the universe would begin to rush in upon itself in a "big crunch." Indeed, this was the prevailing theory for many years.

My thought, however, is that we cannot observe what lies "beyond" spacetime, or the event horizon of our expanding universe.

In a small modification of Einstein's greatest blunder, the cosmologic constant, what if what "lies beyond" is devoid of a structural component that our material universe does not lack. Even an unobservable (to us) something in a dimension we cannot study. Is it beyond possibility that this creates a vacuum of sorts that pulls our universe into it? While vastly simplified, if one were to detonate a CO2 cartridge in a vacuum chamber, each molecule of CO2 would spread out from the point of release until every molecule had uniformly positioned itself within the chamber.

Maybe that is why the universe is expanding and at an ever faster rate. What lies beyond the border of our universe is aborbing our universe into it and a grand cosmic law of thermodynamics (used in allegory) is attempting to distribue time, space, and matter uniformly and thus exerts a pull.

But if that's true and what lies beyond our universe is infinite, then it will be a sad and lonly end for our universe as the distances beyond every object steadily increse until they are no longer observable to one another by any means at all.

Of course, I'm no physicist. Just the musings of a simple country boy.


24 posted on 03/16/2005 12:34:25 PM PST by Heavyrunner (Socialize this.)
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To: PatrickHenry
"When his own Theory of General Relativity clearly showed that the universe should expand or contract, Einstein chose to introduce a new ingredient into his theory. His "cosmological constant" represented a mass density of empty space that drove the universe to expand at an ever-increasing rate."

No. Einstein added his cosmological constant to General Relativity in order to "prove" that our universe was static; neither expanding nor contracting.

Then Hubble's observations disproved Einstein's GR, prompting Einstein to label his "cosmological constant" as his greatest blunder.

25 posted on 03/16/2005 12:36:05 PM PST by Southack (Media Bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: Heavyrunner
Just the musings of a simple country boy.

Well, country boy, that "sad and lonely end" seems to be one of the likely scenarios, whether we're being sucked into a surrounding void or driven to expansion by the big bang. Either way, we're expanding into nothing. Oooops, there goes the Andromeda galaxy. Say goodbye ...

26 posted on 03/16/2005 12:39:39 PM PST by PatrickHenry (<-- Click on my name. The List-O-Links for evolution threads is at my freeper homepage.)
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To: VadeRetro
"Why do I suspect that if the 1998 observations had shown the expansion of the universe slowing down, you'd have a Bible verse or two predicting that?"

Actually there is a verse that says at the end of time, He will roll up the heavens like a scroll, so yes, I would probably say, "it's started". But that's only in there twice and there's something like 16 verses that say He "stretched" or "stretches" the heavens,

So your point is valid. Neither a current expansion, stasis, or contratraction would necessary contradict the scriptures. However, it is notable that the scriptures don't claim a "universe forever in stasis". It did have a beginning and will have an end.

27 posted on 03/16/2005 12:40:37 PM PST by DannyTN
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To: razoroccam

Are they ridges, or waves, or particles??

28 posted on 03/16/2005 12:42:08 PM PST by mikrofon (Astro BUMP)
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To: mikrofon

If you wave it, it appears to have ridges. If you throw it, it is a particle. Which is why I am not rigid about theories - has bad ripple effect.


29 posted on 03/16/2005 12:45:49 PM PST by razoroccam (Then in the name of Allah, they will let loose the Germs of War (http://www.booksurge.com))
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To: VadeRetro

I remember getting ripples from pagan pink.


mc:>)


30 posted on 03/16/2005 12:46:50 PM PST by mcshot (Boldly going nowhere with a smile and appreciation for life.)
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To: Physicist
My pet idea is that the "big rip" that destroys the universe simply serves as the inflationary phase of the universe that follows it.

I like it! < :D

31 posted on 03/16/2005 12:55:58 PM PST by my_pointy_head_is_sharp
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To: Heavyrunner
...until inertia was bled away...

As I understand it, there is no inertia. The matter that makes up the earth is in the exact same place it always has been.
32 posted on 03/16/2005 12:57:13 PM PST by self_evident
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To: PatrickHenry

I read Simon Singh's interesting book "Big Bang", and while it was somewhat enlightening, it did not answer my simple question: If the big bang was not an explosion of matter in space, but rather an expansion of space and the matter within it from a single point, then how come they still talk about the universe as being infinite in extent. How come it is limited in terms of space at the time of the big bang and infinite now? I've read other articles which seem to say differing things -- either the universe is not infinite in space or that it was born in the big bang infinite in space. Why don't they get their story straight and think up an easy way to describe it for the layman?


33 posted on 03/16/2005 12:58:49 PM PST by Unam Sanctam
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To: Conspiracy Guy
This expansion must be stopped. It's for the children.

If we cut down on the carbs and cholesterol, our children will be fine, and so might the universe.
34 posted on 03/16/2005 1:00:43 PM PST by adorno
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To: Heavyrunner
But if that's true and what lies beyond our universe is infinite, then it will be a sad and lonly end for our universe as the distances beyond every object steadily increse until they are no longer observable to one another by any means at all.

Lonely indeed. But don't forget that galaxies are held together by gravity so we will have the whole Milky Way to play around in!
35 posted on 03/16/2005 1:02:54 PM PST by self_evident
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To: TheForceOfOne

We are a virus the universe is trying to stamp out.

Hence, Solar Coronas,Mass Coronal Ejections, Massive emanations from MAGNETARS, comets,earthquakes.


36 posted on 03/16/2005 1:03:54 PM PST by UCANSEE2
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To: adorno

Obesity?


The real problem is physics.

Girth is determined by an individuals resistance to atmospheric pressure (ap). My resistance to ap is low therefore the pressure pushes on my surfaces making me appear slim. Fat people have a high resistance to ap so they spread out. Light people have a high resistance to gravity. Heavy people have little resistance to gravity.

Food has nothing to do with it. We can balance the scales by banning atmospheric pressure and gravity.

"Stop the atmospheric pressure and gravity now! It's for the children!"

CG


37 posted on 03/16/2005 1:06:41 PM PST by Conspiracy Guy (Okay, you evolved. I was created. Get used to it.)
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To: Unam Sanctam
Why don't they get their story straight and think up an easy way to describe it for the layman?

Math is the great divide. Or brick wall for most. It is nearly impossible to describe 11-dimensional space to anyone who lacks the math skills. Even with the math skills it is nearly impossible to visualize beyond four dimensions. They say that engineers have an ability to visualize three dimensions and that is not at all a common ability.

38 posted on 03/16/2005 1:07:14 PM PST by RightWhale (Please correct if cosmic balance requires.)
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To: UCANSEE2
Maybe this is why the universe is expanding, an effort to purge "us" the impurities. Suddenly, I don't feel special anymore! lol
39 posted on 03/16/2005 1:12:32 PM PST by TheForceOfOne
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To: RightWhale

No, if you're saying that all matter was concentrated in one point from a three or four dimensional perspective, but that space was infinite in other dimensions, I can understand that. If that is the case, why don't they just say that? I fully understand that we can't really visualize more than three or four dimensions, but they can at least use understandable words to describe it.


40 posted on 03/16/2005 1:12:38 PM PST by Unam Sanctam
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