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To: sdpatriot

Good luck and good personal fortune to all you *real* patriots out there. I take little offense at your insults. If you had been dragged along with your children through the disgraceful 'family justice' system and had your liberty and right to pursue happiness removed through the seizure of your earning capacity (unfairly) and restricted access to your child (and them to you) would better understand that sticks and stones from you *true* patriots pale in sting. American justice is supposed to be blind, not stupid or malicious as the family courts are. And the injustices are largely driven through Federal mandates.

For all of you on your high American soapboxes of righteousness, your inability to see the direct violation of the equal protection clause of the 14th amendment belies your education about the freedoms this country was founded upon. There is no greater natural freedom than that which grants one the opportunity to be a parent to their child. Society is suffering greatly right now as a result of these violations, and will continue to suffer incrementally as the years go by with this unresolved. The biggest danger that faces this country is the breakdown of the family unit in conjunction with the government-facilitated incentivizaton of the same. Go about your patriotic business, though. I guess an uneducated patriot is sufficient for Uncle Sam's beckoning...

The time is coming for your beloved descendents and loved ones to experience the travesty for themselves and have their rights to be a parent, or as a child to have significant access to both parents, forcibly abrogated by the state you so fervently defend. Enjoy your freedom, my friends... Until you are yourselves caught up in the pain either directly or peripherally (in the same way most Europeans didn't understand the true tragedy and danger of 9/11 because it didn't happen on their soil), that is. That time will come... Either for you or those you care deeply about...


Ex-Patriot Marc


19 posted on 03/06/2005 8:43:28 AM PST by nhman1
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To: nhman1
"The whole world falling apart, and all you can think about is your own feeling. You are a coward and weak." Ilsa

"Look I'm not any good at being noble, but it doesn't take much to see that the troubles of three little people don't amount to a hill of beans in this crazy world. Someday you'll understand that." Rick

Um, she already did...

21 posted on 03/06/2005 8:48:59 AM PST by JasonC
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To: nhman1

the thing is Marc, those who still believe in the Constitution as it was wrote and the BoR and the original intent of the Writers ARE the Patriots. don't call your self "ex-patriot" others who would let those Rights be usurped have stolen the title "patriot". Patrick Henry was a true Patriot - not the nasty over paid lawyers and the power mad men in black robes, nor those who turn a willing blind eye to the facts.

my brother in law lost everything fighting for partial custody. i know where you're coming from.


24 posted on 03/06/2005 9:04:08 AM PST by sdpatriot ("If I know the answer I'll tell you the answer, and if I don't, I'll just respond, cleverly." Rummy)
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To: nhman1
I will attempt the cure. It may not help you, but others may at least see what is happening. If it does help, all the better. Briefly, you should be patriotic because it is not a matter of the perfection of the thing loved, but a transcendent tie of loyalty, that sees clearly all the faults of the country, and wants to change them precisely because of that transcendent tie.

A wiser man explains -

"The point is not that this world is too sad to love or too glad not to love; the point is that when you do love a thing, its gladness is a reason for loving it, and its sadness a reason for loving it more. All optimistic thoughts about England and all pessimistic thoughts about her are alike reasons for the English patriot. Similarly, optimism and pessimism are alike arguments for the cosmic patriot.

Let us suppose we are confronted with a desperate thing -- say Pimlico. If we think what is really best for Pimlico we shall find the thread of thought leads to the throne or the mystic and the arbitrary. It is not enough for a man to disapprove of Pimlico: in that case he will merely cut his throat or move to Chelsea. Nor, certainly, is it enough for a man to approve of Pimlico: for then it will remain Pimlico, which would be awful.

The only way out of it seems to be for somebody to love Pimlico: to love it with a transcendental tie and without any earthly reason. If there arose a man who loved Pimlico, then Pimlico would rise into ivory towers and golden pinnacles; Pimlico would attire herself as a woman does when she is loved.

If men loved Pimlico as mothers love children, arbitrarily, because it is theirs, Pimlico in a year or two might be fairer than Florence. Some readers will say that this is a mere fantasy. I answer that this is the actual history of mankind. This, as a fact, is how cities did grow great.

Go back to the darkest roots of civilization and you will find them knotted round some sacred stone or encircling some sacred well. People first paid honour to a spot and afterwards gained glory for it. Men did not love Rome because she was great. She was great because they had loved her.

Let us reiterate for an instant that the only right optimism is a sort of universal patriotism. What is the matter with the pessimist? I think it can be stated by saying that he is the cosmic anti-patriot. And what is the matter with the anti-patriot? I think it can be stated, without undue bitterness, by saying that he is the candid friend. And what is the matter with the candid friend? There we strike the rock of real life and immutable human nature. I venture to say that what is bad in the candid friend is simply that he is not candid. He is keeping something back -- his own gloomy pleasure in saying unpleasant things. He has a secret desire to hurt, not merely to help.

This is certainly, I think, what makes a certain sort of anti-patriot irritating to healthy citizens. I do not speak (of course) of the anti-patriotism which only irritates feverish stockbrokers and gushing actresses; that is only patriotism speaking plainly. A man who says that no patriot should attack the Boer War until it is over is not worth answering intelligently; he is saying that no good son should warn his mother off a cliff until she has fallen over it.

But there is an anti-patriot who honestly angers honest men, and the explanation of him is, I think, what I have suggested: he is the uncandid candid friend; the man who says, "I am sorry to say we are ruined," and is not sorry at all.

And he may be said, without rhetoric, to be a traitor; for he is using that ugly knowledge which was allowed him to strengthen the army, to discourage people from joining it. Because he is allowed to be pessimistic as a military adviser he is being pessimistic as a recruiting sergeant. Just in the same way the pessimist (who is the cosmic anti-patriot) uses the freedom that life allows to her counsellors to lure away the people from her flag.

Granted that he states only facts, it is still essential to know what are his emotions, what is his motive. It may be that twelve hundred men in Tottenham are down with smallpox; but we want to know whether this is stated by some great philosopher who wants to curse the gods, or only by some common clergyman who wants to help the men.

The evil of the pessimist is, then, not that he chastises gods and men, but that he does not love what he chastises -- he has not this primary and supernatural loyalty to things.

What is the evil of the man commonly called an optimist? Obviously, it is felt that the optimist, wishing to defend the honour of this world, will defend the indefensible. He is the jingo of the universe; he will say, "My cosmos, right or wrong." He will be less inclined to the reform of things; more inclined to a sort of front-bench official answer to all attacks, soothing every one with assurances. He will not wash the world, but whitewash the world.

We say there must be a primal loyalty to life: the only question is, shall it be a natural or a supernatural loyalty? If you like to put it so, shall it be a reasonable or an unreasonable loyalty?

Now, the extraordinary thing is that the bad optimism (the whitewashing, the weak defence of everything) comes in with the reasonable optimism. Rational optimism leads to stagnation: it is irrational optimism that leads to reform.

Let me explain by using once more the parallel of patriotism. The man who is most likely to ruin the place he loves is exactly the man who loves it with a reason. The man who will improve the place is the man who loves it without a reason.

If a man loves some feature of Pimlico (which seems unlikely), he may find himself defending that feature against Pimlico itself. But if he simply loves Pimlico itself, he may lay it waste and turn it into the New Jerusalem. I do not deny that reform may be excessive; I only say that it is the mystic patriot who reforms.

Mere jingo self-contentment is commonest among those who have some pedantic reason for their patriotism. The worst jingoes do not love England, but a theory of England. If we love England for being an empire, we may overrate the success with which we rule the Hindoos. But if we love it only for being a nation, we can face all events: for it would be a nation even if the Hindoos ruled us.

The same women who are ready to defend their men through thick and thin are (in their personal intercourse with the man) almost morbidly lucid about the thinness of his excuses or the thickness of his head. A man's friend likes him but leaves him as he is: his wife loves him and is always trying to turn him into somebody else. Women who are utter mystics in their creed are utter cynics in their criticism.

The devotee is entirely free to criticise; the fanatic can safely be a sceptic. Love is not blind; that is the last thing that it is. Love is bound; and the more it is bound the less it is blind.

This at least had come to be my position about all that was called optimism, pessimism, and improvement. Before any cosmic act of reform we must have a cosmic oath of allegiance. A man must be interested in life, then he could be disinterested in his views of it. "My son give me thy heart"; the heart must be fixed on the right thing: the moment we have a fixed heart we have a free hand.

For our Titanic purposes of faith and revolution, what we need is not the cold acceptance of the world as a compromise, but some way in which we can heartily hate and heartily love it. We do not want joy and anger to neutralize each other and produce a surly contentment; we want a fiercer delight and a fiercer discontent. We have to feel the universe at once as an ogre's castle, to be stormed, and yet as our own cottage, to which we can return at evening. No one doubts that an ordinary man can get on with this world: but we demand not strength enough to get on with it, but strength enough to get it on. Can he hate it enough to change it, and yet love it enough to think it worth changing? Can he look up at its colossal good without once feeling acquiescence? Can he look up at its colossal evil without once feeling despair? Can he, in short, be at once not only a pessimist and an optimist, but a fanatical pessimist and a fanatical optimist? Is he enough of a pagan to die for the world, and enough of a Christian to die to it?

In this combination, I maintain, it is the rational optimist who fails, the irrational optimist who succeeds. He is ready to smash the whole universe for the sake of itself."

- GK Chesterton, "The Flag of the World", Orthodoxy chapter 5

25 posted on 03/06/2005 9:08:39 AM PST by JasonC
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To: nhman1
Petulance and self-pity, wrapped in faux "learnedness," crafted with non-sequitors and irrelevancies. The very ordinariness of your predicament belies the grandiosity of your self-regard.

You're mad, dammit. And somebody will pay!

51 posted on 03/06/2005 3:52:01 PM PST by beckett
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To: nhman1

This is like having a bad day at the office and coming home to abuse your daughter.

Yes, the family court screwed you. Yes, your ex screwed you. Neither has anything to do with the USA as a country.

Yes, the family courts need reforming. Try doing something about it, you'll find many kindred spirits here.

Pull your flag back out.


70 posted on 03/08/2005 1:12:18 PM PST by jimt
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