NBC Show Blasphemes Communion Host

NewsMax ^ | 2/24/05 | Carl Limbacher

[eddie willers]

Lighten up, Francis.

Sheesh...come down south and put milk and sugar in your grits if you want to get even. :o)

[loboinok]

I have always wondered this and this looks as good a thread as any to ask... what are the wafers made of? Who makes them and where do they come from?

[Poser]

"This episode is centered around a Catholic wedding, and the act of serving Holy Communion, whereby two morons get their hands on a consecrated host"

Nope. No wedding.

[GopherGOPer]

Yes you can buy them out of a Catholic supply catalogue, but they are still made by the same Monks and Sisters. Commercially(supermarkets) do not carry them, and they are not meant for use outside of those wishing to use them for Mass.

Out of the same catalogue, you could also purchase vestments, cruettes, pattons and chalices. That doesn't make one a priest though. You can clearly see why these items were made.

[WritableSpace]

If there is anything you hold sacred, imagine an ignoramus doing the same to it and then laughing about it.

Stultus ineptiam suam semper laudat.

[narses]

"So Catholics belief the wafer is PHYSICALLY transformed by the priest at this moment into the ACTUAL Body of Christ?"

Yes, provided the Matter, Form and Intent are correct and the priest is validly ordained.

Invalid Matter (adulterated bread, cake, cookies, etc), invalid Form (a failure to use the Words Our Lord used) and invalid Intent (a priest who has denied the faith and intends to trick people or who intends to NOT actually Consecrate the Host) all or any would make your statement not true, but if all three are present, then God is Present, Body and Blood.

[BriarBey]

Not treating the Host with the reverence you would show Jesus face to face is a serious mistake since they are one in the same. This IS the King of kings. This IS the Son of God. Here is The Messiah.

******

Sorry Gopher, my King and Savior is not a cookie! And when I take communion I do so in rememberance of what HE did for me. I take great offense to the fact there is a religion out there called christian who believes they can turn my Savior into something they can EAT.
So I guess we can just ALL get on the offended bandwagon can't we? Why should your offense be anymore important than mine?

[eddie willers]

Stultus ineptiam suam semper laudat

Translate, please.

[AnAmericanMother]

So you believe that the ACTUAL AND LITERAL Body of Christ is sitting on a Supermarket shelf before the Church buys it and hands it out at Communion?

So average people who go into the store and buy the same crackers/wafers and eat them are ingesting the ACTUAL Body Christ as part of their dinner.

You actually believe this?

No.

Straw man.

The wafers used in the Catholic church are specially prepared for that purpose. They are never near a supermarket.

Moreover, the wafers do not become the Body of Christ until the priest celebrates the Mass. (Usually an altar boy rings a bell three times to call your attention to this event.)

I believe the Communion is a spiritual representation of Christ's flesh and blood.

And that is why you can't take communion in a Catholic church. You don't share the beliefs of the community, it would be contrary to your own beliefs, and discourteous as a guest as well.

I don't take communion in the Episcopal church any more, since when I joined the Catholic Church I subscribed to the Catholic view of the invalidity of Anglican Orders. Therefore, the consecration is not valid; therefore, I should not partake.

[narses]

"My Catholic friends tell me that all non-Catholics are doomed."

If they do, either they are ignorant of Church teaching or they are using shorthand to include all those who Desire to be of Christ (The Baptism of Desire) and are members of His Church. No Catholic ought to preseume to judge the state of another persons soul.

[WritableSpace]

I'm not the one making up dumb arguments, that non sequitor.

[radiohead]

If this is the normal practice of the Catholic Church, in my view, it was not mistakenly given, it was "dishonestly taken".

Good point. I used to be Catholic, am now Jewish. Last time I went to Mass as a participant, you had to go to the altar. If, as a Jew, I now attended someone's funeral Mass, I would know better than to go to the altar and take Communion.

Many Jews wouldn't attend a Mass at all, and those who might attend a funeral Mass would certainly know better than to participate by taking Communion.

Since I ddin't see the show, perhaps I should keep my opinions to myself, but what fun would that be? If they actually depicted a consecrated host being thrown down the toilet, the creators/writers of this show need their heads handed to them on a platter. I agree w/previous posters who've stated that it is open season on Christians. I'm sure if there was some similar Muslim ritual, you'd never see it being made fun of on TV.

[still_learning]

Your response reminded me that BOTW referred to this work of "Art" earlier this week.

http://www.usc.edu/schools/annenberg/asc/projects/comm544/library/images/502.html

An "artist" thought that placing a crucifix in a jar filled with his own urine was a great achievement in furthering our understanding of our world. It did give us great insight into the understanding of liberals when they said public money MUST be used to support the exhibit or else we would be guilty of censorship.

[AnAmericanMother]

You'll note that in Life of Brian, Jesus Himself was played 100 percent, absolutely, utterly straight (in the only cameo appearance). The comedy has to do with poor Brian being mistaken for the Messiah -- which I guess is probably going to offend some folks, but it's not on the same level as committing sacrilege.

[Jorge]

Jorge, you keep referring to your best guess. Please pick up the Holy Bible, and read it with your heart open.

Do actually think handing out Bible reading assignments will cover up the fact that you can't answer questions about the Catholic doctrine you profess to believe?

I know plenty about the Bible. And nothing in it supports your positions as far as I can see.

It's up to you to provide documentation that says otherwise..if in fact you have ever read the Bible.

[GopherGOPer]

We can all be offended because this was a Catholic Mass, where Jesus IS truly present.

If it had happened at a Protestant service, it would be a serious sacrilidge, and still very offensive, but alas it would merely be a representative of Jesus.

Happening at a Catholic Mass, it IS Jesus, it doesn't matter if the people who took it believe it or not, it IS Him.

[sinkspur]

I take great offense to the fact there is a religion out there called christian who believes they can turn my Savior into something they can EAT.

"Unless you eat My Flesh and drink My Blood, you cannot have life in you."

Did Jesus, Himself, say this, or not? And how do you explain away His Words?

[Poser]

"If they do, either they are ignorant of Church teaching or they are using shorthand to include all those who Desire to be of Christ (The Baptism of Desire) and are members of His Church. No Catholic ought to preseume to judge the state of another persons soul."

If you aren't a Catholic, are you a member of His Church?
They aren't judging the state of anyone's soul. They just say that the Catholic Church is the only real church of Christ and if you aren't Catholic, you aren't saved. No judgement, just dogma.

[MWS]

Well, to be accurate, Catholics believe that the wafer and wine are physically transformed by the Holy Spirit at this moment into the actual Body and Blood of Christ. This gets into the philosophical distinction between the essence and accidents (outward appearances). The essence of the wafer and wine are changed into the actual, real Body and Blood of Christ while the accidents of the wafer and wine remain the same.

As for the matter of denying communion, that is not a matter of questioning one's standing before God, but rather a recognition that, when approaching something as holy as the actual body and blood of Christ, sacramental forgiveness is necessary. As I said earlier, a sacrament is an outward, visible expression of the grace of God. In addition, each sacrament not only involves an interaction with God, but also an interaction with the Church (I mean Church as the body of Catholics throughout the world, not merely the hierarchy) as a whole. Communion is not merely a sort of unity with God, but also a unity with the Church itself. Confession is not merely God's forgiveness, but also a matter of being forgiven by the community - it's both.

I suppose that is a bit foreign to one who is not Catholic or Orthodox. This view is based on the notion that God created matter, that matter is good, and that God chooses to act through material means for the sake of our salvation. That is why God gave us the sacraments. Believe it or not, Catholics do not believe that we need to go to a priest to be forgiven by God for our sins: we can make an act of perfect contrition, expressing our regret for sinning out of recognition that our sins seperate us from God. But God also gave us a means to receive sacramental forgiveness, that we might receive added grace to aid us in our battle against sin, and so that there can exist no doubt that we are forgiven. I must admit that, as a Catholic, after I go to confession I feel a burden lifted from my shoulders in such a way to which my private acts of contrition can never compare.

It is that uplifting.

[PAR35]

It blasphemes all faithful Christianity.

No, it is much more of an insult to a Catholic or Lutheran than it would be to one of a denomination who just views communion as a symbolic act. It is merely an insult to other Christians.