Posted on 02/13/2005 10:23:15 AM PST by NCSteve
The sub may not be soundless, but there are techniques, which I am not at liberty to discuss on a public forum (Loose lips sink ships is literally the case), that can be used to keep the sub from being detected.
Is this the one you refer to?
DECISION TRAPS : THE TEN BARRIERS TO DECISION-MAKING AND HOW TO OVERCOME THEM
by Edward Russo
It does sound good. I'll have to see if I can dig up a copy. Thanks.
However, books like this always bring to mind Niven's Laws numbers 17 and 18:
17) No technique works if it isn't used.
18) Not responsible for advice not taken.
Niven's Laws are great - the rest of them can be found here:
http://www.larryniven.org/stories/nivens_laws_2002.htm
I know what you're talking about; that's not being done any longer (that I know of, of course).
The Navy does not produce navigation charts. The National Imagery and Mapping Agency (NIMA, formerly DMA does).
The new USS Scorpion later sank, but that's a discussion for a different thread.
You dont need to read the book. you get it. One of the examples is the O rings in the space shuttle.
They worked 60+ times, so they would always work....
Variations include - I drive drunk all the time and nothing happens- or I crashed but I didn't do much damage.
Conversely, an accident could happen with all procedures being followed properly....
Looks like in this case- the 'other' official detailed maps were not consulted by this loosey goosey crew. But then the question becomes- did the capt have time to clean this part of the boat up? Turnaround agents should be given time or he should have at least been allowed to break the crew up and bring in proven hands- while the others shaped up.
So now we have lost a turnaround guy. Shame.
Right. But presumably these charts are continually 'qualified' as an 'accurate chart'
Nope! If a chart area is surveyed, it is updated. If there is a known hazard or geographical change it is added. Otherwise it stays exactly the same. Forever.
There is - and it's on one of the other threads about the upcoming Captain's mast. I don't know where the picture came from, but you won't believe that this Sub could possibly have made it back to any port with the damage to the sonar bow.
I'm off to find the pic and post it here for ya. Back in a few but will check to see if someone else has found it first...........
Right, they are requalified which is the same. You know what I mean and seem more interested in arguing semantics.
Don't you just hate the way stuff changes and makes you feel so old?
Mooney "hazarded the vessel..."
Is that the same as when a troll "stunes their beeber?"
Sorry. ;)
It's not like the submarine force hasn't 'been there, done that' already! After Pearl Harbor, a few carriers and the Pacific sub force was all we had to prosecute war against Japan until we could rebuild our fleet.
I haven't got the exact figures handy but many sub skippers (maybe 30% or more?) were so risk-adverse they were canned or voluntarily gave up command for not being willing to risk their boats in attacking the enemy! Additionally torpedoes were so valuable (and scarce) at the time that they hadn't been thoroughly tested under war-like conditions. The guys there on the frontlines knoew the damn things weren't working properly and complained, but were ignored by the REMFs... until a commander on-scene made several test shots and proved they were faulty.
As an ex-sub sailor I'm afraid that we've returned to 'those far gone days of yesteryear' with regards to our present day nuke fleet. No skipper will be willing to think outside the box, because that'll be the end of his career. Pretty sad, because I think Kevin Mooney was one of our best.
YES. Remember CONALOG?
It seems I have struck a chord....
Yep, people were getting too much sleep during the midwatch.
From the other threads it is my understanding that at that speed the sub makes so much noise that active Sonar is useless.
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