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To: RightWingNilla; betty boop
Thank you so much for your reply!

Would you classify a sodium ion moving toward a chloride ion as "will"?

No. I would classify it as the effect of a cause.

Right - a metabolic cascade of enzymes is the "communication" between many, many networks of proteins in the machinery. Communication in the sense that A triggers B which triggers C which feeds into another set of reactions etc.

So perhaps we arent so far apart after all.

We are not so far apart.

I can characterize the difference between us as this: you are focusing on the physical, visible effects of the communication happening - whereas I am focused on the causation and then the successful communication itself.

Both the cause (will to live) and the successful communication (Shannon information) are constructs which apply to all living molecular machinery.

Because constructs are fully transportable they can be (and are) analyzed and modeled independently of their application. This is an "unreasonable effectiveness of math" that we can apply Shannon communication theory across a wide variety of disciplines.

Likewise, quantum field theory may help us to understand the "will to live" - causation. Universal applicability to the biosphere (amoeba to whale, kidney to cardiovascular, plants to animals) is what suggests that the “will to live” – the causation – is field-like.

You also said:

But at the same time (and we do this routinely), one can take an enzyme made independently of a living cell and transport it into a live cell. In this case it joins the communication network just fine. So the term "living" molecule is misleading IMO.

Hmmm… I thought I already ‘fixed’ that in my previous post. I should have said “living molecular machinery” not “living molecule”. That was my bad.

854 posted on 02/20/2005 8:38:01 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl
Me: Would you classify a sodium ion moving toward a chloride ion as "will"?

AG:No. I would classify it as the effect of a cause.

Interesting. I am not sure science at this point and time can address what is beyond the cause of the electrostatic forces (which drive everything in biology).

How does one get more of a handle on this cause?

883 posted on 02/22/2005 7:36:49 PM PST by RightWingNilla
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