Posted on 02/01/2005 5:52:21 AM PST by Convert from ECUSA
U.S. Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice says that disengagement from Gush Katif and northern Shomron is fine, but only as a first step towards a full-fledged PLO state.
Rice met with Prime Minister Sharon's top aide Dov Weisglass in Washington on Monday. She explained to him the U.S. position that the unilateral withdrawal from Gaza is acceptable only as a prelude to the full Road Map plan proposed by President Bush.
The Road Map plan calls for a "viable" - i.e., territorially-contiguous - Arab state in Judea, Samaria and Gaza. Rice, as well, emphasized this point to Weisglass. This means that Gaza must be connected with a land-line to Judea, effectively dividing Israel in half, north and south of the Gaza-Hevron connection.
However, Associate Prime Minister Shimon Peres said today, "I think that she was not referring to a connection between Judea and Gaza, but rather to a connection between Judea and Samaria... We do have to ensure, however, that the [PA entity] will be able to effectively move goods between Gaza and Judea."
Prime Minister Sharon often says that the disengagement will help Israel strengthen its hold on five settlement blocs in Judea and Samaria. Nowhere, however, has US President Bush ever promised such support. In a letter to Sharon almost two years ago, Bush wrote only, "In light of new realities on the ground, including already existing major Israeli population centers, it is unrealistic to expect that the outcome of final status negotiations will be a full and complete return to the armistice lines of 1949..."
Rice's statements that the disengagement is only a first step further erodes Israeli hopes that the international community will approve extensive Israeli presence in the Biblical homeland areas it liberated in the Six Day War of 1967.
Secretary Rice is expected to arrive in Israel in the coming days. Upon assuming her post as Secretary of State last week, Rice said she sees the implementation of an arrangement in the Middle East a "personal objective."
Excerpts from the Road Map plan as issued by the U.S. Department of State on April 30, 2003: "A two state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict will only be achieved through an end to violence and terrorism, when the Palestinian people have a leadership acting decisively against terror and willing and able to build a practicing democracy based on tolerance and liberty, and through Israel's readiness to do what is necessary for a democratic Palestinian state to be established, and a clear, unambiguous acceptance by both parties of the goal of a negotiated settlement as described below. The Quartet will assist and facilitate implementation of the plan, starting in Phase I, including direct discussions between the parties as required. The plan establishes a realistic timeline for implementation. However, as a performance-based plan, progress will require and depend upon the good faith efforts of the parties, and their compliance with each of the obligations outlined below...
"A settlement, negotiated between the parties, will result in the emergence of an independent, democratic, and viable Palestinian state living side by side in peace and security with Israel and its other neighbors...
"In Phase I, the Palestinians immediately undertake an unconditional cessation of violence according to the steps outlined below; such action should be accompanied by supportive measures undertaken by Israel... Israel also freezes all settlement activity, consistent with the Mitchell report. "* Palestinian leadership issues unequivocal statement reiterating Israel's right to exist in peace and security and calling for an immediate and unconditional ceasefire to end armed activity and all acts of violence against Israelis anywhere. All official Palestinian institutions end incitement against Israel. "* Israeli leadership issues unequivocal statement affirming its commitment to the two-state vision of an independent, viable, sovereign Palestinian state living in peace and security alongside Israel, as expressed by President Bush, and calling for an immediate end to violence against Palestinians everywhere. All official Israeli institutions end incitement against Palestinians. "* Palestinians declare an unequivocal end to violence and terrorism and undertake visible efforts on the ground to arrest, disrupt, and restrain individuals and groups conducting and planning violent attacks on Israelis anywhere. "* Israel immediately dismantles settlement outposts erected since March 2001. "* Consistent with the Mitchell Report, Israel freezes all settlement activity (including natural growth of settlements). "* [In the final stage,] Parties reach final and comprehensive permanent status agreement that ends the Israel-Palestinian conflict in 2005, through a settlement negotiated between the parties based on UNSCR 242, 338, and 1397, that ends the occupation that began in 1967, and includes an agreed, just, fair, and realistic solution to the refugee issue, and a negotiated resolution on the status of Jerusalem that takes into account the political and religious concerns of both sides, and protects the religious interests of Jews, Christians, and Muslims worldwide, and fulfills the vision of two states, Israel and sovereign, independent, democratic and viable Palestine, living side-by-side in peace and security. "* Arab state acceptance of full normal relations with Israel and security for all the states of the region in the context of a comprehensive Arab-Israeli peace."
And will have nothing where you would have them go. So why should they leave just because Israel tells them to?
No Arab state in Eretz Yisrael. EVER!
I'm merely saying that thanks to islam devout chr*stians are attacking "theocracy" and celebrating "freedom of religion" when ultimately there is no such thing. The problem with "islamic theocracy" (as with "chr*stian theocracy" or any other non-kosher variety) is that it's the wrong religion. And considering that Torah enjoins the death penalty for adultery (granted, only if a large number of contingencies are met) and permits a man to have more than one wife at a time, some of the enlightenment, anti-theocracy rhetoric is getting to me, is all. I attack islam for a number of reasons, but "theocracy" and its incompatibility with the "enlightenment" aren't among them.
I am happy that Orthodox Jews get along well with chr*stians. It's just that in the past Orthodox Jews have forgotten their own Theocratic heritage in order to invoke the "enlightenment" against chr*stians, as both chr*stians and Jews now do with regard to islam.
And Kahana' was right. I don't think you and I have anything to quarrel about.
I didn't mean to "jump on" her. And it isn't just her, either. The United States of America is a secular state that does not officially recognize Israel's G-d or Israel as anything but just another friendly country. And all these Fundamentalist Protestants and Orthodox Jews who think otherwise are going to be bitterly disappointed every single time.
Being a primitive, bloodthirsty, neanderthal religious type (and not "indigenous" enough to get away with it), I'm not interested in any secular version of "peace and democracy." I'm waitin' for the Temple, y'all. Or as the old lady said, "Honey, when the Kohen Gadol see a red heifer, he gwine sacrifice it."
if the pals ever get to the point where israel has to do this,well things will be alot better off then today,my $$ is on the palestinians"never missing an oppurtunity to miss an oppurtunity" once again
Im not looking for a quarrel and your right we dont have anything to quarrel about.
I was just trying to clear things up.
When you join the State Department do you have to check your brain at the door?
Exactly.
Disappointment ping!
True words, Words, the palis seem to always "get" without "giving".
All those lopsided prisoner exchanges over the years come to mind as an example.
Agreed. Israel has done more than enough. The wall is a good thing.
Hahaha. No joy in Mudville, mighty Casey Abbas is striking out......
And remember the Palestinians never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity.
Well said
Does Ms Rice have an email address?
Nuts!
It reminds me the tram line that cut the ghetto in half in The Pianist
They have struck out a thousand times. Killed Americans around the world, blown up school buses and celebrated, danced on 911. Killed Kennedy, slaughtered captured diplomats in lebanon. And most important, they have turned down a State a few times already. It has never been about a State, it has always been about Jihad.
Rather than a State, Israel needs to declare war, drive out the Muslim invaders and free the Christian Arabs under the Palestinian whip.
They are starving, ***kd over and totally oppressed. But what can they do to fight four well equipped and powerful politically connected army's when they cannot even feed their kids? Even if Condi and Bush were struck by lightning and suddenly realized creating a terrorist state out of a democracy was not logical, or even desirable to the "War on Terror", How can the Arabs fight the entire Arab League that has camped on their backs. Say something anti-Jihad and you get delivered to your family in plastic bags.
You want a free Palestine, the simple way is to return the land to the nearest free country, Israel and stop sending money to terrorists. It was the Oslo bright boys that thought that giving control of hunks of Israel to the terrorist's would bring peace. Surprise surprise, it brought a war.
Besides the glaring error of trying to build one terrorist up while trying to destroy another in the name of "The War on Terror", arse kissing murderers degrades America and makes us look like fools.
The only thing that makes sense at this point is that the Palestinians have told the US that they have back pack nukes in place inside the borders of the States and we believe them.
You seem to have thought about this. Tell me, if the money spent on terrorism was instead spent on real estate, would the "people" that Hamas and the like claim to be fighting for have a parcel of ground by now?
Yes, their batting average is sterling in that regard.
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