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To: Lazamataz

There goes that Amendment. Strike "unreasonable search" from the record.


23 posted on 01/24/2005 9:36:55 AM PST by thoughtomator (Meet the new Abbas, same as the old Abbas)
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To: thoughtomator
"There goes that Amendment. Strike "unreasonable search" from the record."

The 4th amendment was rendered superfluous the first time that the Supreme Court ruled that the amendment authorized "reasonable" search and siezures.

This interpretation of the 4th amendment is a common error made by the citizenry and the courts.

The first part of the 4th amendment, similar to the 2nd amendment, is a "description" as to why there is a need for the amemdment and the second part of the 4th amendment describes the "ONLY" proper procedures that must be followed in order to search citizens and seize their property.

Allowing for "reasonable" search and seizures without sworn warrants being issued is ludicrous and is anti-liberty because that means every search and seizure has to be litigated for "reasonableness."

Again, the intent of the 4th amendment was to prevent "reasonable" search and seizures without a warrant.

129 posted on 01/24/2005 10:27:59 AM PST by tahiti
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To: thoughtomator
There goes that Amendment. Strike "unreasonable search" from the record.

Definitely. You've inspired me to do a tally, healthy, injured or dead:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; : Injured. There are loads of laws respecing religion, both supporing and limiting it.

or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press;: Healthy. I can't think of any clear examples.

or the right of the people peaceably to assemble: Dead. "Free speech zones" with selective enforcement and denial of permits.

and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.: Healthy.

the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.: Injured. I see lots of infringements on the books.

The right of the people to be ... against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated: Injured. This case and many others are bringing it close to dead.

and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.: Injured. PATRIOT really cut that one down.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury: Dead. Technically still there, but subverted by a rubber-stamp grand jury system.

nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy: Dead. Now we try you for a crime, and if not guilty, try you again for violating someone's civil rights while committing the crime you've just been found not guilty of committing.

nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself: Healthy. They can do this in grand juries by giving you immunity, but since you do have immunity I'd say it still stands.

nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law: Dead. PATRIOT and executive order in the WOT.

nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.: Injured. Between WOD seizures and eminent domain abuses. Would be dead but fore recent seizure reform.

the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial: Injured. How long did they hold Kevin Mitnick? Would be dead but for how rare it is.

by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed: Dead. With jury selection as it is these days, it's hardly impartial anymore. Plus, law doesn't allow you to have a jury for various small crimes.

and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.: Dead. Money is still needed for a proper implementation of this, and that doesn't count the government claiming "national security" to keep your witnesses from appearing.

Amendment VII: Healthy.

Excessive bail shall not be required, ...: Injured. Bail often too high, but punishment is not cruel.

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.: Dead, oh so very dead.

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.: Dead. Fedgov rules all.

We're not doing too well, are we? Any comments about my evaluations?

234 posted on 01/24/2005 11:06:13 AM PST by antiRepublicrat
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