NEW BID TO MAKE CITY 51ST STATE (NYC)

New York Post ^ | January 18, 2005 | STEPHANIE GASKELL

[nickcarraway]

Should New York City become the 51st state?

A bill that would create a commission to study whether the city should secede from New York state will get another hearing soon — after sitting in the City Council for nearly two years

The bill was introduced on Feb. 26, 2003. A hearing was held shortly after, but no action has been taken on the bill since then.

"I expected delays and opposition when we got to the state level, but I never thought it would be held up for two years trying to get out of a City Council committee," said Councilman Peter Vallone Jr. (D-Queens), who introduced the bill.

[Grampa Dave]

I agree with your comments. Just add LA, Chicago and a few other totally "Blue" cities. Then the conservatives in those states which surround these Left Wing Ghettos will have their own senators and congressits.

"What a cool idea.....isolate the leftist whackjobs! I think this approach could also work for SF, Seattle, Portland, and other blue state strongholds!"

[steveegg]

Do states need to be contingent? If not, I say let NYC, LA, Detroit, Chicago, San Francisco, Philadelphia and Milwaukee join up in one mega city-state

[MCHawking]

As a conservative former New Yorker, I have to object to all the mudslinging. Despite the preponderance of liberals, NYC is the best city in America (in the world, maybe), no matter what your political persuasion. Unmatched for art, culture, cuisine, entertainment, architecture, or going out and getting krunked until 4 a.m.

[MCHawking]

Actually, all my favorite cities are liberal enclaves. New York, Boston, San Francisco...what can I say, I'm a nightlife guy. I grew up in republican, suburban New Jersey and it's just BORING out there. I think we conservatives need to found our own cool conservative city--why should liberals be the only ones who can walk to a museum?

[MadIvan]

No. This would embolden DC's efforts for statehood; that polity is so dysfunctional that Al Sharpton could conceivably be elected as a DC senator.

Regards, Ivan

[Wallace T.]

Secession within a state is an extremely difficult process. In the entire history of the country, this has been done only twice: Maine being carved out of Massachusetts in 1820 and West Virginia out of Virginia in 1862. Maine was spun off from the Bay State only to balance the number of free states with those of slave states. Yankee settlement of the frontier in the early years of the republic was not as aggressive as that of the Middle Atlantic and Southeastern States. By 1820, New Englanders had only penetrated into northern Ohio even as the cutting edge of Southern settlement had already reached northeast Texas. Missouri, a slave state largely settled by Virginians and Kentuckians, was admitted into the Union only due to a compromise that admitted Maine.

As for West Virginia's entry into the Union, this was essentially a extra-constituitonal wartime measure as the Old Dominion certainly never consented to the separation of the northwestern counties. Northern West Virginia was largely settled by Pennsylvanians, with economic and cultural ties closer to Pittsburgh than to Richmond. The rest of the Mountain State, though settled by Virginians or directly from Scotland and Northern Ireland, resented the Tidewater and Piedmont aristocracy dominating politics in Richmond.

Splitting New York (or California, Illinois, Pennsylvania, Washington, or Oregon) would be difficult. First, there is the question as to where the state line would be drawn. The street systems of New York City, etc., flow directly into the suburbs. Suburban areas, especially those closer to the city line, tend to be culturally and politically similar to their central city. What does Great Neck have in common with the Finger Lakes, Pasadena with the San Joaquin Valley, Evanston with Little Egypt, etc.? Then, there is the question of where suburbia ends and whether outer suburbs or exurbs would prefer to align with the new state or the original one. Would, say, Irvine or San Juan Capistrano really want to join a liberal dominated coastal state or remain under the authority of Sacramento?

State splitting would be a good thing for Republicans and conservatives. Presently, the six states I mentioned above are represented by only one conservative Republican (Santorum), one moderate Republican (Gordon Smith), one RINO (Specter), and nine liberal and leftist Democrats (Boxer, Feinstein, Durbin, Obama, Hillary Clinton, Schumer, Patsy Murray, Cantwell, Wyden). Basically, we are looking at 1 1/2 votes for the good guys (half credit for moderate Republicans) to 10 1/2 for the libs, or a 12.5% ratio. Were 12 states to replace the existing six, the city-based states would vote 12 liberals into the Senate with little doubt. Of the rural based states, all but downstate Illinois and upstate New York would be solidly GOP. Assuming a 50-50 conservative moderate GOP split, the "rumps" of OR, WA, CA, and PA would give us four conservatives and four moderates. My guess is that downstate IL would give us one conservative Republican and one moderately liberal Democrat, while upstate NY would give us a moderate Republican and one liberal Democrat. The final lineup would be five conservative Republicans, five moderate Republicans, and 14 liberal Democrats. The good guys would increase their percentage to 31%.

No doubt the Democrats can do the math as well and would oppose any state splitting on both the state and Federal levels.

[AuH2ORepublican]

See post #131 with my suggestion about what to do about DC.

[anniegetyourgun]

Welcome to FR.

[from occupied ga]

There were a series of population weighted county maps that were even on this forum just after the election. I think they showed that even upstate had a pretty heavy Kerry weight, so even if NYC was flushed away the more populous areas like Erie County might carry the rest of the state for the Dems. I can't find the maps, but if someone could it would help.

[scottybk]

The gravy train from the Upstate Tax Slaves would end and they would be belly-up within a year. Never happen
______________________________________________________

Try within 10 minutes. No city in the world has nastier, more spineless, ignorant Council than NY. Little nerd Gifford Miller and his pal Bloomberg (who is nothing more than McGreevey w/ a fatter wallet) would have the "state" so far in debt they'd make Bangladesh seem well off.

[CIB-173RDABN]

You are right, I forgot about Orange County

[from occupied ga]

here is the map I was looking for

Note the large Kerry weights in Buffalo, Syracuse and Ithaca

[HighWheeler]

We need suggestions on what to call this new state. I have a couple:

Newyorkistan

New France

[HighWheeler]

"Transparant attempt by liberals to gain two more Democratic Senators."

Whose votes would be cancelled by the two Republican Senators from Upstate, thus putting the Dems out by even more.

[b4its2late]

Then New York State will be a red state (maybe).

[thoughtomator]

If NYC were a state on its own, the rest of the state would be deep red and elect 2 GOP Senators. Let NYC be a 51st state, it would be appropriate.

[from occupied ga]

If NYC were a state on its own, the rest of the state would be deep red and elect 2 GOP Senators.

Not necessarily true. Look at map in post 152 especially buffalo, Syracuse, Ithaca and what appears to be Binghamton, not to mention the Watertown, and Lake Placid area

[Foolsgold]

Don't forget Las Angeles, How about the "State of Confusion", La, San Jose and San Francisco

[weegee]

2 Senators, at least one representative, and the ability to spend all of their massive tax base purely on NYC (although there would be more people working in NYC-State than living there).

If we are going to start adding states again, then let's get them all divided up properly. Texas splits to 5 states (as was left on the table when it joined the US), maybe some of those territories will join in, Washington D.C. could give it a go (although it makes as much sense to me as "living" at City Hall in any city).

[angcat]

I agree! Someone wrote that NYers are walking around like 9/11 never happened. I would assume these people are transplants. Real NYers like me will never rest until all responsible parties pay for 9/11.