Nuclear Submarine Runs Aground South of Guam

The Associated Press ^ | Jan 8, 2005 | The Associated Press

[Jet Jaguar]

HONOLULU (AP) - A nuclear submarine ran aground about 350 miles south of Guam, injuring several sailors, one of them critically, the Navy said.

There were no reports of damage to the USS San Francisco's reactor plant, which was operating normally, the Navy said.

Jon Yoshishige, a spokesman for the U.S. Pacific Fleet based at Pearl Harbor, said the Friday afternoon incident is under investigation and the 360-foot submarine was headed back to its home port in Guam.

Details on the sailors' injuries were not immediately available. The sub has a crew of 137, officials said.

Military and Coast Guard aircraft from Guam were en route to monitor the submarine and assist if needed, the Navy said.

Guam is a U.S. territory about 3,700 miles southwest of Hawaii.

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On the Net:

U.S. Pacific Fleet: http://www.cpf.navy.mil

AP-ES-01-08-05 0343EST

[SS Guy]

If memory serves, I think Kaiser Aluminum pioneered the modular method on a grand scale with the Liberty Ships of WWII fame.

The Germans were building their type XXI & XXIII subs that way at the end of the war. Parts/Sections were built all over Germany and shipped to the slipways. 6 weeks from start to finish for launch. The ways were then freed up for the next boat.

[SS Guy]

In response to a question asked on an other board this was Jim Christley's anwers:

---

This is a bit wordy and just an opinion. Agreement is not required.

While the boats today are a quantum leap above the old fleet boat in terms of technology, they are just as likely to fall in the clutches of old problems.

The question boils down to "Why did it happen"

The answer falls into one of several areas.

1. The thing they ran into isn't supposed to be where its at, at the depth its at. One has to assume the chart information is correct. If its not, all bets are off. Our charts, while good are not perfect. Of course this begs the question, if the chart is no good, why was the boat going that fast that deep. The answer to that is relatively simple. Some years ago the section of I-95 that goes across the Mianis River in Connecticut fell in at night. Several people traveling at 'the speed limit' ran off the bridge into the river and died. We assume the path chosen is clear and safe. If its not and we don't know it, all bets are off. Submarines don't use active sonar systems in some evolutions. A high speed transit where the boat is to be undetected is one of those. The SanFran might have been doing that, we don't know.

2. Someone might have screwed up. Plotted the wrong course, inputted the wrong way points. Misread an instrument or tried to take a shortcut. In this instance, the problem must be found and corrected and the guilty must be shown what responsibility means. No matter who it is. And make no mistake, this problem might not be on the boat. If the boat was told to go from A to B directly and given a speed and depth (so someone else could try to detect it) the problem might lie off the boat.

3. The instruments and or computer programs may be in error or generating an error. In this case, we must make them better because they are not safe enough to allow certain types of operations.

We sailors have been running into things since we have been floating on logs. SanFran is just the latest in a long line of groundings which transcend the technology and presence or lack of quartermasters. Trust me, the problem isn't that simple. Guardfish hit Oahu in 1966-67 with good navigation and quartermasters. Tiru hit a reef in 1966. Sam Houston hit several things in a 6 month period. Back in the old days, (1910-1940) boats used to run into everything they could on an average of once a month in some years to once every six months. We have hit each other, Cape Cod (many times) the coast of California and the East coast of the US. During WWII we lost several boats simply due to running aground.
While true the boats today have many better things, they aren't tracking around on the surface at a 10 Knot SOA. They are pushing the envelope as they should and there is a risk.

This is not in defense of the change in the rating structure, but I have been out too long to be of any use in that argument. Like the change of uniforms, its not real important how you dress the sailor, only how well you train him/her. And as for rates, I don't care what you call me, long as its not late for first call to midrats, but thats just me.

Be assured that if there is a problem it will be found and corrected and that process will be painful. And-- this is most important as any COB or LPO will tell you. Just because you fixed it on ustafish, doesn't mean the fix is permanent or fleet wide.

We seem to be screwing up more often. I don't think we are, I really think its more public now. I do know this. In keeping the list of our lost shipmates and updating it when necessary, we are killing our shipmates a lot less often than we did in the past. (peacetime, I mean)

Just a longwinded look at whats happening.
Thanks for the listen
Jim

[Doohickey]

Depending on the extent of damage, Yokosuska my be a possiblity as well.

[CivilWolf]

Very good post. My thoughts exactly and you just typed the right words in the right manner. I will omit details, but that is the single best explanation of recent situations.

[CivilWolf]

Injury Update

---

Nearly all sailors injured aboard USS San Francisco treated and released from hospital


by Ken Wetmore, KUAM News
Tuesday, January 11, 2005


Of the 23 injured sailors aboard the USS San Francisco, all but three have been treated and released from Naval Hospital in Agana Heights. COMNARMAR spokesperson Lt. Arwen Consaul says the three who remain in the hospital are listed in stable condition, and at least one will be released tomorrow.

The 23 were injured saturday when the San Francisco ran aground about 350 miles south of Guam while conducting submerged exercises on her way to a port call in Australia. Machinist Mate 2nd Class Joseph Ashley of Ohio lost his life in the accident and today Pacific Submarine Force spokesperson Lt. Commander Jeff Davis said a memorial service has tentatively been scheduled for this Thursday at COMNAVMAR.

Lt. Commander Davis says further details have yet to be finalized.

As for the damages sustained to the San Franscico, the Pacific Submarine Force spokesperson says crews have been going over the submarine since last night and the Navy is still evaluating the full extent of damages. Lt. Commander Davis would not comment on what damages have been sustained, only saying there has been significant damage to the front of the submarine. He says once the Navy determines all the damages they will come up with a plan of action for repairing the San Francisco and at that time will determine where the repairs will be done.

In the meantime, the New York Times and MSNBC have reported unnamed Navy officials have told them the San Francisco was submerged more than 400 feet below the surface and traveling at around 30 knots when the accident occurred. MSNBC reported that their sources say the submarine's sonar systems were damaged in the collision and the New York Times reports one officer saying some of the ships ballast tanks that are needed to resurface were damaged, making keeping the submarine afloat initially "very touch and go".

Lt. Commander Davis refused to confirm the information found in either report.

[RebelTex]

"FWIW - here's a link over to my favorite Sub page for those who wonder what it takes mentally to be one who wears the dolphins. See FOR I AM A SUBMARINER

http://www.csp.navy.mil/mission.htm  "

That's an inspiring website and a good tribute to all submariners.

I do have one question, though.  The main page lists a number of Guiding Principals, among which is the following:

Train and equip our forces to operate with the Army, Air Force, Coast Guard, our friends and allies.

My question is:  What about working with the rest of the Navy or (should I even mention) the Marines (Are they called jarheads or leathernecks?)  Aren't they friends and allies?

Just kidding  ;^D   and ducking for the door before the Marines respond.

[IonImplantGuru]

This in from a chief on the San Francisco; [I've put explanations for some terms inside brackets just like this for folks not in the sub profession]:

To All, I thought that I would put out a note since a lot of you have been calling and writing to find out how things are and if I'm OK and what happened. If you hadn't heard, my boat hit a uncharted submerged sea mount at the highest speed we can go at about 500ft below the surface. There were about 30 of us that were seriously hurt and unfortunately one of my shipmates didn't make it.

First off I am OK. I am pretty beat up with my entire left side and butt as one big bruise. My shoulder is separated and may require surgery. They will evaluate later this week. I am very fortunate that I hit the wall and didn't go down a ladderwell that was right next to where I hit. If I had gone down that, I would have got really messed up. I took a tremendous shot to my left thigh from something. If it had been slightly lower in the knee area it would have been really ugly. But all in all I am in good shape.

We hit it at about noon right after field day (where all of us clean the boat for several hours). Thank God we didn't hit while we were doing this or it would have been much worse. We would have had flying deck plates through the air and such. Not good. As it was, it happened while chow was going on and most people were either sitting and eating or on watch.

I don't remember much of the collision. People describe it as like in the movie the Matrix where everything slowed down and levitated and then went flying forward faster that the brain can process. My mind has blanked it out exactly what happened. Adrenaline kicked in and I have no real memory of how I got down to middle level [of 3 in a single large compartment forward of the reactor and engineering spaces. Upper level is control area, CO/XO staterooms radio room, sonar etc. Middle level is crews mess, crew's berthing, storage, reefers and some environmental control equipment. Lower level is for the torpedo room, more berthing, auxiliary equipment, freezers and so forth. Below all that is the battery well,] or what I did immediately following. I helped carry several shipmates to the crew mess deck (adrenaline is a wonderful thing - my shoulder was wrecked and I had no idea until about 4 hours later). I sat with several of my junior guys that had bad head wounds and talked with them to keep them conscious until doc could see them. It seemed like an eternity but I'm sure wasn't that long. For those Navy folks that ever wondered why Chief's stomp around and preach "Stow for Sea" This was a perfect example. It definitely saved lives.

I am extremely proud of the crew to do damage control, help the wounded and get the boat safely to the surface (for the boat guys we blew the tanks dry on the emergency blow but unbeknownst to us we were missing some ballast tanks/some didn’t have integrity). The ship's control party did every thing exactly right even though they were hurt as well. The Diving Officer of the Watch had just unbuckled his belt [watchstanders in control such as helmsman, planesman, etc. must wear seatbelts when running submerged 'at speed' - for just such an eventuality as this incident] to update a status board and hit the Ship's Control Panel hard enough to break some of the gages. To add insult to injury his chair came up right behind him. Several people were injured in the Engine Room Lower Level area. Lots of metal and sharp edges in the area as well as that's were the boat's smoking area is at. Several crew members are reevaluating that habit now.

Once again we got lucky in the fact that we had an extra corpsman [essentially a highly qualified EMT - certified to be the only medical support on subs] onboard. One of our officers was a prior enlisted corpsman that was a Fleet Marine Force medic so he was a Godsend for us. Our Corpsman did an outstanding job getting everyone stabilized and did the best he could for our fallen shipmate. I am surprised that he got him to hold on as long as he did. Our corpsman is definitely a hero in my book. He didn't sleep for 2 or 3 days.

We finally put him down when the SEAL docs helicoptered in to help. Like I said, I am extremely proud of my crew and how they handled themselves. My Chief of the Boat [COB - the senior enlisted man aboard and right-hand man to skipper and XO] was an inspiration of what a leader should be and my Captain was as well. My XO took out an EAB manifold [Emergency Air Breathing - a series of manifolds throughout the boat into which the crew plugs in air masks if the air in the boat is unbreathable] with his back but still managed to help coordinate things. No matter what happens later, these men did a superior job under difficult circumstances. I am humbled by the entire crew's performance from the CO down to the Seaman that I was checking in two days before.

For those of you wondering, I am sure there will be an investigation into what happened and no I was not part of the navigation preps for this voyage. I work on the inertial/electronic navigation and interior communications part of my rate and didn't have anything to do with the conventional navigation part of it. I will be lending support to my comrades who were, to help them prepare for the pending investigation.

I thank you all for you concern and appreciate your prayers not only for myself, but for my shipmates. We are doing well, we band of brothers and will pull through just fine.

Thanks,

Xxxx Yyyy Zzzz

[Dog Gone]

Great post. Thanks for sharing that with us, along with the explanations of some technical terms.

[RebelTex]

"Sorry about the abbreviations..."    post # 1031

and

"In essence, a floating dry dock is like a garage and lift for marine repairs."   post # 1032

 ROFLMAO, FWIW, IMHO, (rolling on floor laughing my a** off, for what its worth, in my humble opinion) I found your analogy hysterical.  The picture conjured up in my poor mind was of a sub pulling into a dry dock and the Captain shouting out:  "Change the oil, check the transmission fluid, and rotate the tires."

It's a good thing I wasn't drinking coffee when I read your post, or you would owe me a new screen and keyboard.

;^D

[HipShot]

Thank you for the update.

"Uncharted" needs to be the word of the day every day for a while.

[BIGLOOK]

Thanks for the post and ping, Guru.

Godspeed to the crew of USS San Francisco.

[Robert A Cook PE]

The picture conjured up in my poor mind was of a sub pulling into a dry dock and the Captain shouting out: "Change the oil, check the transmission fluid, and rotate the tires."

I'm smiling too:

Ya know that service writer who meets you at the garage door?

That's what I did: OK Captain.... Rotating and balancing the fans will cost you xx,xxx.xx dollars, changing the lube oil and hydraulic pump will cost you yyy,yyy.yy dollars, and painting the hull will cost you another z,zzz,zzz.zz dollars ...

[Bottom_Gun]

Thanks for the ping Guru,

This goes to show why we train till you can do the stuff in your sleep. I'm extermely proud of this crew in their ability, and will to fight the ship, and get her back to port in one piece.

Godspeed to her and all her crew

[SmithL]

What a great read.
Thanks.

[mad_as_he$$]

Hey thanks again for the info. I knew the first rev was way heavy (per usual mil projects!) and also about the planes being moved. I have been told by some people that that actually made them better handling. I suspect because the are larger. Overall neat boat and I am proud of the sailors who saved her. I bet they now do not regret the rigors of sub school!!!

[PogySailor]

Thanks for the updated information. I had wondered what time of "day" the accident happened. Right after field day, that figures. Sometimes on my boats we had GMT at the start of the watch after a morning field day so at least 2 watch sections would have been up.

I wonder how many people sustained neck injuries from being thrown forward (or out of) in their bunk.

[SS Guy]

Very good post. My thoughts exactly and you just typed the right words in the right manner. I will omit details, but that is the single best explanation of recent situations.

If you check the very top of that post you will see it was made by Jim Christley on another board, I just reposted it. I only wish I could write as well.

:-)

SS Guy

[Severa]

That was one thing about Admiral Rickover: That man was hated by SO many ppl for his brashness and just overall being a royal pain in the ass, but he was QUITE adamant about the need for rigorous training for the sailors and attention to detail on the construction of the submarines.

[Ready4Freddy]

Guru, many thanks for the update! Flank speed at 500 ft, and the boat survived. What an epic!

Question - how would the writer know this already?

...my boat hit a uncharted submerged sea mount...

[mad_as_he$$]

The Admiral was one heck of a guy. I watched his BIO on the Bio channel (I think). He was known for no compromises.

FWIW does anybody here know anything about the Seawolf? She seems to have disappeared.