Posted on 12/18/2004 6:45:29 PM PST by nanak
I find it a bit crass the way you just focus on hispanic victims and perps, to make a crass political point.
JMO, you're following hillary's lead, in playing race card politics.
But all they really care about is paying dirt-cheap wages to their illegal alien nannies, factory workers, and landscapers, and letting the taxpayers foot the bill for their medical expenses and education.
I can understand "rich people" advocating the above - but it appears to me that there are many others who feel the same way. It makes no sense to me, since it hits their pocket books in the form of job losses, tax increases, and reduced benefits for all of us (emergency care units, for one).
I had somebody wanting to pay me to marry them. I even had somebody wanting to buy my social security card. They figured since I was retiring that I wouldn't need it any more. Why didn't I turn those people in? Because nothing would have been done about it. The immigration people don't care!
However, in Las Vegas, the casinos care. They are very strict about obeying the law. Why other employers are allowed to get away with disobeying the law is beyong me. If the law-breaking employers were heavily fined, even imprisoned, the jobs would dry up. The illegals would go home, and no more would show up.
BTW, I was wondering how the sales of your book are coming along. My eyes are too bad now, so I can't read books any more. Since I have the Internet now with enlarged print, it doesn't bother me too much usually. But I did wish I could read YOUR book. :0)
So does the *guest worker* program come before or after Mexico cleans house ??
No one said it was going to be easy. The cold war lasted 46 years.
Again who do you would you want to lead the effort, Bush, kerry, hillary, dean.
I've seen way too much hyperbole on this thread; and much of it from YOU. No one here would vote for the Hilda-Beast, so you can stop with that strawman, as well.
You say you're not for open borders, yet you oppose a wall to help defend our border. Well hells bells Dane, haven't you heard of the backpaking drug mules who just stroll across our borders with kilos of cocaine? There is actually a corridor in AZ called Cocaine Alley, in Cochise.
Talk about hyperbole: you refer to the Berlin Wall, which was there to keep people IN, not keep bad people out, drug smugglers, etall.
Also, if you think this country can afford to employ, provide food and shelter, and provide proper law enforcement for to the 10,000 new untrained illegal immigrants that come into this country each day; then you are seriously delusional.
I'm glad you're for English immersion; but good luck with teaching over 3 million new under-educated spanish only folks a year.
And as for the guest worker program: the experts at the Center for Immigration studies don't agree.
Please read this article:
http://www.cis.org/articles/2001/back801.html
That's what they keep saying about Blair, but what of it. No matter what is going on in Mexico we will still have a demand for cheap labor in the USA. The supply will follow the demand. We do not have control over the affairs of Mexico, but we can tackle the problem of 15 million illegals within the USA. In order to deport even five million we will need the cooperation of the Mexican government.
Wow, someone was going to give you a reverse dowry, that's rare. Where did you meet these people, at work, acquaintances?
If the law-breaking employers were heavily fined, even imprisoned, the jobs would dry up. The illegals would go home, and no more would show up
See that's where I disagree. These people are building houses, picking vegetables, making beds, contributing to the economy. There is an obvious need for the labor and the jobs(building houses, picking vegetables) are not what I or even you would consider evil. Building houses and picking vegetables contribute to the economy.
My contention is that a guest worker program would help these people who take economic risks and are trying to build houses and pick their crops. I'm sorry I don't see home builders and farmers as evil professions.
Now if they were pimps or drug dealers, I would agree with you, but the vast majority aren't.
RIDICULOUS !!! if you mean that because the 'illegal alien' was in caps.......then you must also *believe* that only ARIZONA COPS are shot (as these two words were in caps also).
when it was shown that all people of different colors and ethnicities shoot at cops, in their knee jerk embarassment some posters go on an ad hominem frenzy.
ROTFLMAO.......Oh yeah, we all thought only hispanics shot cops until YOU proved us wrong........& called us racist for threads we DIDN"T post on.....
(btw are you racist ?? you didn't post on that thread either.)
-Far less crass than your post that I was responding to, and you know it Dane.
-You tried to get away with implying that Hispanics are being targeted as criminals. I pointed out that fallacy, by pointing out the victims of illegal aliens are often Hispanics themselves.
>"JMO, you're following hillary's lead, in playing race card politics."<
There you go with the flawed logic again, ad hominem attack, etc.
Well, I guess thats it for substance of your debate.
Take care.
I've seen many people on FR praise hillary on her so called turnaround. Just pointing out the fact that she is pandering and also pointing out how the Cclintons say one thing and do another(remember middle class tax cut, being tough on China, ending welfare as we know it).
Talk about hyperbole: you refer to the Berlin Wall, which was there to keep people IN, not keep bad people out, drug smugglers, etall
It still fell, showing that Berlin type walls don't work especially in these modern times.
Again JMO, a guest worker program would bring some sanity to the system, putting generally honest people above board, leaving resources and policies to go after the bad guys.
No I didn't post on that thread, but if you take a look at the two threads, this one and the one linked on reply #76 of this thread, you will notice that the one linked in reply #76 isn't titled nor the replies try to make crass political points as this one is, IMO.
ONE six year term in mexico.....it's the law, & they enforce it just as they do their immigration laws.
Myself, I don't think GWB is making many *political points* when we still have illegals crossing our borders & shooting our cops.
Vargas, Victor
Reyes, Ramon
Perez, Demecio Carlos
Nistal, Cesar
Monarrez, Jesse Enrique
Contreras, Byron Adolfo
Colby, Kirk Lamont*
Campos, Fausto Adalberto
Bonilla, Pedro Antonio
Akopyan, Vahagan*
Why, because they comprise 8 of the 10 Most Wanted by LAPD?
I agree, that isn't fair, is it?
Multiculturalism was supposed to correct that, wasn't it? I'll call Bill Frist in the morning and remind him about it. He can get Diane and Hillary right on it.
We should be more tolerant towards foreigners. Our problem is we're to damn strict. Give us a few years and to get used to their ways. Then we'll quit bitching about any laws that are broken and just smile when someone mentions what nice people they are.
After all they do cut our lawns and babysit our kids, so it's obvious they aren't bad people, just a little different.
Even Mexicans here complain about how much like Mexico we've become --- and everyone knows if the welfare handouts from Washington were to slow up, this area would be a disaster --- probably with a lot of violence.
It's like anything --- we're all influenced by what we see first hand --- I can pass by a field of old men working hard in the hot sun --- and my opinions for that day are softened, but then I read about a drive-by shooting in my neighborhood or talk to kids (hispanic) who have been jumped by the gangs and are afraid to go out at night and then my opinions change again. Or when I drive through the areas --- which is almost everyplace now and see the iron bars over all windows and doors and the high fences everyone is putting up --- and I don't like the Mexicanization of this area.
It's not happening though is it. And it's not going to happen as long as the borders are wide-open and we're the dumping ground for all their great social problems. Mexico is exploding in crime --- and you're going to see more street protests --- so far they've been peaceful -- of Mexicans concerned over crime --- even if it's criminals with hispanic last names --- which doesn't make them racists --- they know it's Mexican criminals terrorizing them. But it's not always going to be peaceful --- just like the lynching and burning alive of 3 Mexican policemen --- and try to find a Mexican that is on the side of the cops in that one.
Maybe not as fast enough for you, but it will happen some day, and who would you rather have doing the negotiating with the Mexicans, Bush/Rice, or hillary/strobe talbott.
Sorry I'm just not a fatalist on all things in Mexico as you are.
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