Excuse the cheap shot, but that does help explain why they remain unconvinced.
I originally argued that in order for Havoc to be correct, all of physics, chemistry, biology and geology would have to be wrong, and havoc would have to be smarter than all the scientists who have lived in the past 200 years.
That's an absurd assertion. ALL of physics? All of chemistry? You are certainly intimate with the straw man fallacy! There is but one conclusion to be drawn from your fantastic fabrication: Havoc is not refutable so you must manufacture his position in order to deal with it.
I hope the lurkers you think you are persuading can see that your challenge is to a windmill, not Havoc.
I followed up with a list of specific questions, to which havoc has not responded. Give it a go if you like, post #565.
You've got it. When he can't answer, I must then detail the volumes of everything written in the system since adam and yay or nay it one by one - an utter absurdity that he's well aware of. And basically a duck and run move relying on rhetoric rather than evidence or science. Begging the question in the largest possible way IMO. Tawdry, isn't it lol