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WHAT'S WRONG WITH PLAYERS ON STEROIDS?
NY Post ^ | Dec 7, 2004 | JOHN R. LOTT JR. & SONYA D. JONES

Posted on 12/07/2004 8:27:12 AM PST by Tumbleweed_Connection

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To: Mo1
Amen...

People abuse all sorts of substances. Unless we want cradle to grave montioring from Government nannies, then we just need to accept the fact that some people will do stupid stuff to themselves and let them get on with it. The sooner they are out of the way, the better off the gene pool will be...

121 posted on 12/07/2004 1:44:26 PM PST by Dead Corpse (Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.)
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To: Fatalis
. . . the simplest and most reasonable explanation is that the leaks came from the prosecutor's office.

What incentive does a member of the prosecutor's office have to engage in conduct that could land him/her in jail like this?

Any court employee who had access to these records could have been the source of the leak.

122 posted on 12/07/2004 6:26:11 PM PST by Alberta's Child (If whiskey was his mistress, his true love was the West . . .)
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To: hobbes1
Yes, but Hank Aaron didn't play in an era when the strike zone was reduced in size to such an extent that hitters are practically able to dictate what kinds of pitches they face.

Take a look at the strike zone as defined in the rule book (which is already smaller than it was in Aaron's day), then watch a major league baseball game today . . . and tell me that hitters today have a more difficult time than they did 40 years ago.

123 posted on 12/07/2004 6:30:00 PM PST by Alberta's Child (If whiskey was his mistress, his true love was the West . . .)
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To: hobbes1

I left McGwire off that list because his career was already over for all intents and purposes by the time those "conversations" took place -- so his name didn't even come up.


124 posted on 12/07/2004 6:33:05 PM PST by Alberta's Child (If whiskey was his mistress, his true love was the West . . .)
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To: Dead Corpse

DC be gentle with me, I am not much a sports fan, but I seem to recall that MLB enjoys an anti-trust exemption that no other sport is privleged to have. Therefore, when you have a special dispensation from the govt be prepared to have them meddle where they shouldn't.


125 posted on 12/07/2004 7:04:05 PM PST by kmiller1k (remain calm)
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To: Alberta's Child
What incentive does a member of the prosecutor's office have to engage in conduct that could land him/her in jail like this?

Bonds was the real target all along. There was quite a lengthy and detailed story about it in Playboy about ten months ago, about several of the people responsible for getting the federal investigation off the ground. For public consumption, the athletes were subpoenaed by the grand jury to testify in the BALCO investigation. The truth is that BALCO was investigated to nail Bonds. The leaks are designed to rattle testimony and spring perjury traps. The prosecutors know the press won't give them up.


Any court employee who had access to these records could have been the source of the leak.

Sure they could, but your argument about the prosecutors office fearing jail would apply just as well to them. The motive for and the manner of the leaks best fits the prosecutors' office.

126 posted on 12/07/2004 8:08:50 PM PST by Fatalis
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To: Fatalis
The prosecutors know the press won't give them up.

That seems like a huge gamble on their part, doesn't it?

. . . your argument about the prosecutors office fearing jail would apply just as well to them.

True, but I would think a low-level court clerk or other similar employee would be more susceptible to offers of financial compensation than a lawyer would in a case like this -- mainly because the lawyer's career would effectively be over if he were ever caught.

Why doesn't someone investigate the reporter who ran the story, and prosecute him if he doesn't reveal the source of the information?

127 posted on 12/07/2004 8:16:50 PM PST by Alberta's Child (If whiskey was his mistress, his true love was the West . . .)
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To: Alberta's Child
That seems like a huge gamble on their part, doesn't it?

So was taking steroids. The parallels between the prosecutorial and athletic misconduct are many in the BALCO case. That's in part why I said that I had as much reason to believe as I do about the prosecutors as anyone does about Baseball: they both smell fishy.


True, but I would think a low-level court clerk or other similar employee would be more susceptible to offers of financial compensation than a lawyer would in a case like this -- mainly because the lawyer's career would effectively be over if he were ever caught.

Both the clerk's and the journalists' careers would be over if the leak was motivated by bribery. I don't believe that First Amendment protections would apply if there was ever any indication of bribery. The nature and timing of the leaks has the appearance of prosecutorial gamesmanship, which leaves the journalist far less exposed.


Why doesn't someone investigate the reporter who ran the story, and prosecute him if he doesn't reveal the source of the information?

I'd love to see it, but I'm skeptical it would amount to anything more than possibly a martyred reporter serving some time for contempt before being released and receiving a Pulitzer.

128 posted on 12/07/2004 8:33:26 PM PST by Fatalis
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection

What's wrong with it is that people don't want their kids to grow up admiring some guy who injects gorilla pi** in his veins. Role models have a responsibility to behave at least halfway like a role model should, whether they want to or not.


129 posted on 12/07/2004 8:40:21 PM PST by LibWhacker
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
This spring a baseball players' union representative, Gene Orza, claimed that steroids are "not worse than cigarettes."

In a curious twist of metaphors, according to Orza's wife, her husband's "private part" is no bigger than a "cigarette filter."

130 posted on 12/07/2004 8:46:34 PM PST by F16Fighter
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To: kmiller1k
You bring up an excellent point. Why the anti-trust exemption? What puts them above the law and by what authority did the FedGov give it to them?

Two wrongs do not make a right. No more so than circular logic. If we go that route, the liberals win.

131 posted on 12/07/2004 8:50:02 PM PST by Dead Corpse (Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.)
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To: LibWhacker

Then provide a better role model for your kids. If you go looking to GOVERNMENT for your kids role models, you are already in some pretty sorry shape.


132 posted on 12/07/2004 8:51:03 PM PST by Dead Corpse (Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.)
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To: Dead Corpse
Sure, tell your kid he can only admire you. That'll work.
133 posted on 12/07/2004 9:05:57 PM PST by LibWhacker
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To: Dead Corpse

It would be interesting to look up when MLB gained their anti-trust exemption. In the early years, perhaps during WW2? I mention this in this respect: If the exemption was granted during that time it most likely was because baseball raised the American spirit during a difficult era in our history. But does baseball raise the American spirit today? I grew up with "franchise" players--you were drafted and stayed loyal to your team, for most players. But now, free agency, doping, the designated hitter, these have changed the sport from the American Past-time to the American scandal. Who is next??


134 posted on 12/07/2004 10:26:12 PM PST by kmiller1k (remain calm)
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To: Fatalis

If a journalist offered a prosecutor $25,000 for confidential information, he'd probably get turned down. That same $25,000 would be a lot of money to a low-level court employee.


135 posted on 12/08/2004 6:12:49 AM PST by Alberta's Child (If whiskey was his mistress, his true love was the West . . .)
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To: Alberta's Child
I left McGwire off that list because his career was already over for all intents and purposes by the time those "conversations" took place

True, but his little Andro window dressing is what put Prohormones on Congress' to do list. HE killed a large segment of the Supplement industry, in order to hide what he was doing, and the dmaned sprotswriters let HIM get away with it, because they liked him.

136 posted on 12/08/2004 6:17:35 AM PST by hobbes1 (Hobbes1TheOmniscient® "I know everything so you don't have to" ;)
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To: Fatalis
The truth is that BALCO was investigated to nail Bonds.

That's Backwards. Bonds is caught in the Governments war against the supplement Industry.

First Ephedra, using Steve Bechler as the impetus, Then Prohormones using McGwire, and now Victor Conte, and Balco, who if you look hard enough you can see exactly how big a part of the supplement industry he was. Conte and anotherman Patrick Arnold were big time pioneers in an industry that caters mostly to fitness buffs, and yet in a time of a supposed national obesity crisis, the government is using dubious methods and regulation to shut them down.

Follow the money.

137 posted on 12/08/2004 6:22:37 AM PST by hobbes1 (Hobbes1TheOmniscient® "I know everything so you don't have to" ;)
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To: LibWhacker
Sure, tell your kid he can only admire you. That'll work.

If you want to be an absentee or POS parent, that's your call. Just keep your brats away from my kids.

138 posted on 12/08/2004 6:47:50 AM PST by Dead Corpse (Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.)
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To: kmiller1k
Check out Post 137. Hobbes1 has teh right of it. Why is our own government waging a "war" against an entire industry in a supposedly capitalistic society based on individual Rights and Freedom?

If we are no longer able to assume our own comfort levels for risk in anything, are we really still free? If we can't stand up and say, "Ok... I know this crap could kill me, but that is my choice"... then we are all just wards of the State and should just give up the pretense and the false advertising.

139 posted on 12/08/2004 6:51:58 AM PST by Dead Corpse (Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.)
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To: Dead Corpse

That's why out of all of these guys, I Hate McGwire the most.
The sprotswriters gave him a free pass, instead of asking the one inteligent question "Was it possible in 1997, to put on that much muscle using the primitive form of Andro available".

So in the facilitatation his little charade, Prohormones got put on Congress' kill list, and entire industry got legislated out of existence.


140 posted on 12/08/2004 7:07:24 AM PST by hobbes1 (Hobbes1TheOmniscient® "I know everything so you don't have to" ;)
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