IBM puts its PC business up for sale - NY Times

Yahoo ^

[Sub-Driver]

IBM puts its PC business up for sale - NY Times Fri Dec 3, 2004 01:40 AM ET NEW YORK, Dec 3 (Reuters) - International Business Machines Corp. (IBM.N: Quote, Profile, Research) has put its personal computing business up for sale in a deal that could be worth as much as $2 billion, the New York Times reported on Friday.

IBM, now the No. 3 PC maker behind Dell Inc. (DELL.O: Quote, Profile, Research) and Hewlett-Packard Co. (HPQ.N: Quote, Profile, Research) , is likely to include all of its desktop, laptop and notebook computers in the sale, which could earn it between $1 billion and $2 billion, people close to the negotiations told the newspaper.

Lenovo Group Ltd. (0992.HK: Quote, Profile, Research) , China's top PC maker, and at least one other company are said to be in talks with IBM, the Times reported. There have been media reports that Lenovo, which controls more than a quarter of China's PC market, was poised to set up a joint venture with IBM.

[wai-ming]

IBM puts its PC business up for sale - NY Times.

I didn't know IBM owned the New York Times. That is one PC business I would get rid of too.

[Gay State Conservative]

If it's bought by a Chinese firm,I'll have to add IBM
(personal PCs) to my "boycott" list,for every penny
spent on Chinese-made goods or goods sold by Chinese
companies,goes toward Chinese nuclear subs off of our
shores and the shores of our allies.

[chilepepper]

outright sale is not likely to happen... the fact that IBM is willing to put its name on it is the reason IBM laptops for example are so popular. a "Lenovo" Thinkpad just ain't going to be very attractive IMHO.

a joint venture is more likely, as pointed out in the register

[Sam the Sham]

The IBM logo is if you are a business that needs 24-7 hardware support. THAT is what you are paying for.

[Dalite]

Well, maybe Bill Gates will finally get over his feud with IBM over not accepting the version of the basic programming environment that he wrote and offered to them in the very early days.

MSBasic vs Basica, MSDOS vs PCDos, and who can forget the battle of the network software standards.

If IBM hadn't been so top heavy in bureaucracy, their micro-channel architecture may have been able to capture the Video market, by getting there first.

IBM has been plagued as being an elephant competing in a footrace that required dynamic action; quickly executed.

Now, Gates may be able to turn his attention to producing a quality OS and not punishing the consumer to get back at IBM, as he has done the past 1/4 century.

[Glenn]

Now, Gates may be able to turn his attention to producing a quality OS and not punishing the consumer to get back at IBM, as he has done the past 1/4 century.

Have you been asleep since 1990?

[G Larry]

Somebody wake up the State Dept. and remind them that its their job to ensure China DOES NOT buy IBMs PC division.

[ARCADIA]

IBM - minus its PC business= Leave what?

What are they going to do, live off a few mainframe boxes? Sell typewriters?

[RightOnline]

"IBM has been plagued as being an elephant competing in a footrace that required dynamic action; quickly executed."

Hardly. Take a look at revenue, market share, growth......virtually any category you wish in the server and services markets. Not even close.

[Dalite]

"The IBM logo is if you are a business that needs 24-7 hardware support. THAT is what you are paying for."

Only if you are able to continually buy their "latest mousetrap" in order to have support that is affordable and cost efficient.

IBM has consistently made ownership of older systems prohibitive in terms of service contract expense.

In my museum, I have 2 System 36 systems, both given away due to upgrading to newer systems that carries affordable service contracts. I also have a fair sampling of their PC based systems, as well as Unix and CPM machines from various manufactures.

The junkyards are the best place to get old IBM technology, as they pay the highest price to past owners; just for the metal content and the re-mining rights to super conductor material used in the circuit boards. No one wants to (or can afford to) purchase older IBM technology with plans of putting it into operation. Service and parts are just too hard to come by for a business to have an older IBM Mini computer system in operation and having to depend on it for a living.

I turned down an AS-400 over the weekend; nearly a "come and get it" situation.

This will probably seem to many as a "So What" post.

This is the "What":. In 1981, IBM realized that many smaller businesses would never be able to justify the expense of their Mini Computers (System 3X).

They decided to design a desktop box to meet the needs of smaller business owners. Their criteria was simple; single user and single task. In other words, the entire PC market was born out of a design that specifically was designed from the ground up to only allow one user, and one task at a time - Single User, Single Task.

They felt that 64K of RAM was the maximum that the platform could support, and the maximum that any customer would ever, in their lifetime, need for any application.

This is what your "confuser" is probably a descendant of; unless you run a 68xxx based micro pro, which is a true multi-task, multi-user processor.

Now, what do we run? Windoze - A multitask, multi user OS. We run it in a box that was copied from a design that was created to only allow a single user to perform a single task.

Is it any wonder that Windows is considered "Gates Revenge"?

[Dalite]

Have you been asleep since 1990?

Actually, I started sleeping all day in 1995, when I retired out of the industry.

I am no longer Compaq, IBM or Novell certified.

However, I do have a few archival OS copies to base some claims; from DOS v 2.10 through 6.23; all versions of Windows, and the experiences I have plowed through in trying to get them to perform in a stable manner in a diverse market.

When I retired, I left a contract here I was maintaining over 6000 line items in over 2000 PC bases systems for a government installation.

If you feel Windows is a quality product, then I am probably wasting bandwidth in this reply.

Call me a pinhead, by I have never relished having to pay retail to beta test a product, and then having to start all over with another retail purchase once the corrections that I (and others have found) have been implemented. thereby creating more demons to overcome.

[Dalite]

"Hardly. Take a look at revenue, market share, growth......virtually any category you wish in the server and services markets. Not even close.">/i>

That would pretty much explain while they came in third out of 3 competing for the small-systems market share...

You sound like you are comparing IBM to government.

The idea is to stay in business and make a profit. In the past 20 years, IBM has laid off enough workers to start their own unemployment crisis, and they still can't compete because of their own top-heaviness.

[Glenn]

If you feel Windows is a quality product, then I am probably wasting bandwidth in this reply.

I was speaking to your ignorance of the history of OS's and the fight between IBM and Microsoft. IBM lost. Microsoft won. That's just the way it is. Everything else is trivia.

[RightOnline]

Don't know what you do for a living, but you're woefully uninformed. Go check out IDC data on the market. Then get back to me.

[eno_]

IBM is SCREWED due to their pension obligations. From their current position, they can't possibly grow their way out of it.

Want to know why the auto industry is so heavily regulated? Ford and GM are just as screwed by pensions. If they let new competitors in, it would be game-over in 5 years. If the Chinese ever learn how to make a car, fuhgeddaboudit!

[Dalite]

"I was speaking to your ignorance of the history of OS's and the fight between IBM and Microsoft. IBM lost. Microsoft won. That's just the way it is. Everything else is trivia.""

I thought I pointed that out fairly plainly in earlier posts; even as recently as in the post in which you quoted my last line.

My point is that Microsoft still has a long way to go.

If you advocate giving up on advancement after you eliminate the first barrier, then we are doomed.

My total point before, as it is now: Now Bill Gates can direct his company toward forward motion; rather than revenge.

You call it trivia, I call it looking toward the future.

To each his Dulcinea

[Mr. Jeeves]

What are they going to do, live off a few mainframe boxes? Sell typewriters?

Consulting services, software...and licensing patents to other manufacturers, I guess. Consulting/outsourcing is the big one - IBM is way behind Deliotte and Accenture, but they see that market being where the money is. IBM is just recognizing that no one is going to be able to compete with Dell in the ultra-low-margin PC business unless they have an entirely Chinese-based operation.

[Dalite]

"Don't know what you do for a living, but you're woefully uninformed. Go check out IDC data on the market. Then get back to me"

IBM, now the No. 3 PC maker behind Dell Inc. (DELL.O: Quote, Profile, Research) and Hewlett-Packard Co. (HPQ.N: Quote, Profile, Research) , is likely to include all of its desktop, laptop and notebook computers in the sale, which could earn it between $1 billion and $2 billion, people close to the negotiations told the newspaper.

Any questions?

[Dalite]

"IBM is SCREWED due to their pension obligations. From their current position, they can't possibly grow their way out of it. "

I think this is a fairly concise statement of their current position.

I hope that the proceeds from this sale will allow them to be fair to their employees (past and present) and still give them enough capital to continue their mini computer production and support.