Posted on 11/28/2004 7:14:11 AM PST by GRRRRR
Don't overreact, IHSA Barry Temkin
November 28, 2004
CHAMPAIGN -- Welcome, students, to Illinois High School Association University. Please proceed to your classes.
Sterling Newman Catholic, you're in Class 2A. Driscoll is in 3A, Montini in 4A, Joliet Catholic in 5A--and Providence, you're in 6A. But don't carve your initials in any desks because you private schools probably won't be there for long.
You see, the IHSA has this task force studying why private schools win so darn many state titles in some sports even though public schools far outnumber them. And by the next school year, the state tournament format in several sports, including football, may be as easy to figure out as the Bears' passing game.
What we're talking about is a multiplier, a number that would boost private schools' enrollments--and perhaps those of public schools without attendance boundaries--for postseason purposes. Driscoll, for instance, you might jump to 4A or 5A, depending on how big a multiplier they come up with, and Joliet Catholic might jump to 9A.
What's that? There is no 9A? I was just kidding . . . I think.
Why do we need a multiplier? Well, a lot of people from small and midsized public schools believe private schools have an unfair advantage because they have no attendance boundaries and can draw athletes from as far as 30 miles away.
The result, they say, is too much private-school success in football and other sports. Grumbling has been growing, so we have the task force.
(Excerpt) Read more at chicagosports.chicagotribune.com ...
"I would argue that's not exactly a level playing field," he said.
Matt Senffner, who has coached Providence to all nine of its state titles, says his team's success stems more from showing up at 5:30 a.m. for off-season agility drills than from recruiting advantages. ------------------------------------------------------------
There is also a second article in the Chicago Tribune today that contains more "whining" from the Public Skools--
"Leveling of playing field near BY BOB SAKAMOTO AND NATHAN BAIRD
November 28, 2004
CHAMPAIGN -- Dave Gannaway sat in the Memorial Stadium suite surveying the Class 3A title game as Driscoll began pulling away from Manlius Bureau Valley and another Catholic school won a state title.
Gannaway, the Illinois High School Association administrator in charge of football, mulled over the prospect that parochial schools would come away with five of the eight championships even as the IHSA is wrestling with the controversial public-vs.-private school competition issue.
"Regardless of what happens this weekend, it won't make a difference with our committee's work on this project," Gannaway said. "There are several concepts being considered. One is a multiplier that would reclassify the non-boundary schools.
"My gut feeling is there is going to be a change that will affect all high school sports in Illinois. It will affect football more than other sports because it has more classes."
The IHSA board of directors is expected to consider a proposal to make changes at its February or March meeting, and changes would be enacted sometime in the spring.
There have been two similar private-public school task forces assembled since the early 1990s that resulted in a clearer definition of the recruitment of students by private schools and a rule limiting those schools to a 30-mile radius.
"There probably won't ever be a clear-cut, equitable solution to this issue--just by the nature of how private and public schools are set up," Gannaway said."
"There's no magic," he said. "It's called hard work. (Excerpted...)
http://bugmenot.com if you need to read the total articles...
Essentially, the grist is above. Private High Schools are whipping the public skools butts in athletics in ILL.
Joliet Catholic HS has won 12 State Titles...they draw from the Kane County area, south-west of Chicago. There are plenty of other private schools in the 30 mile radius around Chicago that DON'T make it to the state playoffs, and they also have a huge pool of students to feed into their programs...the whiners argue that it's just not FAIR!!
G
We made the changes in Missouri and it seems to have worked out well so far. It was difficult to compete with all-boys high schools and all-girls high schools, who were classified as smaller schools, but had the double the number of athletes of one gender. Our small schools had to compete with another small school, who just happened to have a couple of players who ended up in the NBA. Don't tell me that the private schools don't recruit athletes, either. My son was recruited while in high school although he certainly was not Catholic. I don't know the answer, but there definitely was a problem in Missouri and the playing field has been levelled somewhat.
In OH the private Catholic schools do very well in state tourneys, probably similar to how they do in IL.
There isn't whining about it in OH. Maybe it's because OH is a red state, IL is blue (seriously). Ohioans who complain about "inequity" would get laughed out of the state. In IL whiners get taken seriously.
The only thing that I can think of that could conceivably be unfair is if single-sex (all-male) private schools are combined in the same division with both-sex schools with equal total enrollment. I doubt very much that this is happening.
The "multiplier that would reclassify non-boundary schools" is simply flat-out (mostly) religious discrimination.
In neighboring Missouri I don't believe any private schools made it to the championship games in football.
The private schools, mostly religous, are usually a contender every year. Could it be that they have great coaching? Could it be that talent is God Given?
Those religous schools may even have God on their side and we are told that since God cannot attend public schools, there is an unacceptable advantage for the private schools?
How funny!! Good luck Illinois! Sounds like the powers that be want to keep private schools from competing by placing restrictions to make it harder to participate. It is all about seperating church and state. Church schools have an unfair advantage!
And IMHO it's Baloney.
It's ironic, but there's NO whining when schools like Crane Tech or Marshal HS from Chicago (all black students) win the Basketball Championship year in and year out. That's OK, no 'parity' needed then, right?!?
O'Zark---I think you might be "right on" with your great coaching comment.
There is much more freedom at our Catholic HS. The students go to mass as an entire school each week. They have religion classes. Their homework load is immense, my kid has all Honor's classes 'cept one. These students have more discipline, they wear uniforms, name tags and if they foul up they have detention for shirt tails hanging out, no name tags or speeding in the parking lot (AHEM!!!)
I think it's a discipline thing...great expectations yield great accomplishments, students who WANT to be there for education vs. students who HAVE to be there...
Maybe the public skools could lurn sumpthin'?
G
Can't find the article with the link you provided.
I can log on to the Tribune just fine. Just can't find the article.
Duh...the reason that private schools win is that they recruit.
They should be winning.
There is nothing wrong with that. That is just the way it is. In most states private schools play a championship game within their own private league.
Congrats to Coach Mike Pappocia and the Sterling Newman Central Catholic High School Comets on their state title (I think that makes two state Football championships for Coach Pappocia's teams)! I believe it's better discipline and the work ethic that is inherent in schools such as Newman as opposed to the average government school.
The whiners will try to change the rules to affect the outcome they want - sounds typical for a liberal blue-state mindset!
Keep up the good work, Comets!!!!!!!!
It's in the SPORTS section, you have to click on the "more" at the bottom of the list of articles...
G
When the competition was shifted from athletics to academics, the superiority of private and parochial schools is even more pronounced. The problem is not recruitment or single gender schools but the profound and comprehensive dysfunction of the public school system. Why not aim reform efforts in that direction?
It sounds like the whiners are those who want to play under a diffent set of rules.
It's kind of like the Dems wanting to control advertising and retain a monopoly in information during an election...and then wanting to count over and over again until they win.
If you want to try to rationalize that public vs. private football is a fair playing field, then let's hear no more arguments against quotas and other such fair things in life.
To create a more open environment for making a decision on the multiplier I think the IHSA should release all of the formal complaints they have received in the last four years accusing talented athletes of enrolling at a public school other than the one in whose attendance boundaries they originally lived. You could also throw in complaints about prohibited recruiting contacts as well as efforts by athletes to shop around for schools with a winning program.
Both Country Day and St. Vincent's made it to the championship this year. I think they both won. I don't think it is whining when you object to recruitment and playing against a small private school that has 80 boys suited up against your small school that has 30.
I can only go by what one basketball referee told me. He said he had never seen so many black Catholics playing on teams from private schools.
Recruiting could be an issue.
Discipline, tradition, and coaching is more an issue in my mind. In Cincinnati, the parochial catholic leagues are tough; the win a lot. But there are public high schools just as good. (My public school alma mater is just about prepared to win the state football title next week...and they're blowing other schools away.)
In Cincy they should be worried more about why Xavier high school turned out about 30 National Merit Scholars last year to the closest public school's 6 or 7.
Their teachers are paid less, their parents have to pay tuition, and transportation is generally a private issue to be resolved by the family.
So, even if it is recruiting, why do parents want their kids in those schools?
I say it again: discipline, tradition, coaching (teaching.)
I hated playing Catholic schools in Football. They used to kick out butts. Not surprised by any of this.
Essentially, the private schools can recruit specific sports talent and offer scholarships. The public schools cannot. It isn't really a matter of the private school being superior; it is a matter of trying to make an appearance of competion when the playing fields are not level.
The leftists who run virtually every program and institution in Illinois (except the parochial schools, and that drives them nuts) have akways been for "equality of outcome" for their millions of dependants rather than equality of opportunity. Believe me, if the public schools won most of the championships the leftists in charge would be telling the parochial schools to pound sand, and to "try harder." God, I hate what the left has done to this state (and to America) over the years.
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