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Atheists sue to stop Christian mentoring
WorldNetDaily ^ | 11/27/04 | WorldNetDaily

Posted on 11/27/2004 2:50:54 PM PST by wagglebee

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To: TheDon

I also think our positions are very close, but the rhetoric we use is important and I understand we may continue to have our differences. I respect your positions, though. And like you, I am adamant about allowing Christianity in our public arena. Christmas, memorial crosses, 10 commandment icons, civic prayer, all of those things should be welcomed. I think it's important to be careful about how we refer to those religious practices, however. I'm clearly more worried about that than most here on FR.

The question at hand has several facets. On a "conservative forum," the interesting ones beyond mere advocacy are where we might learn from our differences. I think rhetoric is important, and I think those who would manipulate the faithful know this.

On the issue of federal, state, county, and city funding for Christian outreaches (e.g. faith based ministries) I haven't made up my mind. I think involving faith in ministry to the poor is a very positive thing, and I think the secular approach of the government is aseptic and unfeeling; it is also easy to corrupt. Maybe what I really want is an option to donate a portion of one's taxes to an approved charity list. But the Islamic outreaches will sneak in and snag their share; they also get into our prison systems this way. So will the Wiccan, and the other non-western belief systems which I find to be superstitious and backward.


181 posted on 11/28/2004 8:11:36 AM PST by risk
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To: risk
Maybe what I really want is an option to donate a portion of one's taxes to an approved charity list.

That only defers the problem. The feds would be able to determine who gets on and off the list.

Constitutionally (speaking of using language the right way), the federal government has no power to be involved in charity at all, either religious or secular.

182 posted on 11/28/2004 8:29:11 AM PST by inquest (Now is the time to remove the leftist influence from the GOP. "Unity" can wait.)
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Comment #183 Removed by Moderator

To: ZellsBells

It matters to a-theists. If they come from God, then they are "bad" and must be eliminated.

And the funny thing is that every religion in the world has the same basic rules.

Those rules are a manual from the manufacturer.


184 posted on 11/28/2004 9:07:07 AM PST by little jeremiah (Moral absolutes are what make humans human.)
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To: LiteKeeper
Selective use of history

Try again, I said recent history.

185 posted on 11/28/2004 9:08:43 AM PST by jwalsh07
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To: risk

I don't think the gov't should be involved in the "charity" business. I refer to gov't "charity" as "coercive philanthropy". I think all charity should be non-gov't, and no one should be forced. However, if gov't is to be involved, religion should not be used as a factor for exclusion from such programs.


186 posted on 11/28/2004 9:15:46 AM PST by TheDon (The Democratic Party is the party of TREASON)
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To: Americana Belle

Ping


187 posted on 11/28/2004 5:47:14 PM PST by EdReform (Free Republic - helping to keep our country a free republic. Thank you for your financial support!)
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To: Zeroisanumber
Exchange the word "God" in your post for "Allah" or "Karma" and I guarantee that you'll become as enthused as I am with the idea.

I could just say that Allah and Karma would be different in that situation because they are false religions.

But leaving that aside for the moment, if our government were to fund Muslim "mentoring" programs (do Muslims "mentor"?) then that is a legal decision. If I would accept Christian mentoring, then I would have to accept Muslim mentoring. I wouldn't sue to stop it. I might work against it because I would worry about the results of raising children in the Islamic faith, but I wouldn't see it as illegal.

188 posted on 11/28/2004 6:08:19 PM PST by Zack Nguyen
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To: NoClones
more of these fringe-running, wacko groups roosting here in wisconsin...
it must be the cold that affects their minds that way

The fringe running wacko groups on both the left or right are the reason many things are taken out of some schools. Remember what happened with the wacko dad and the pledge of allegiance? My church in my home state negotiated with the school district to have an hour of religious instruction per day for its members. The only objections were from other church leaders in the community. Thankfully, the program was allowed and continues to this day with the full support of the school. My brother, however, was prevented from saying a graduation prayer because of some objections from community church leaders, not any school official. That has been the case more and more.

As for me and MOST teachers I know, we would welcome Christian mentors. I actually remember several when I went to high school and also benefited from the strong role models I had in my community and church (including my high school principal, some teachers, church leaders and most of all my parents). Faith-based mentoring is wonderful. It actually shows some people who ask what they can do rather than behave like the education liberals do by continually trashing the system and promoting their political agenda against schools using liberal arguments and tactics.
189 posted on 11/30/2004 9:57:18 AM PST by moog (a "liberal" teacher)
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To: warchild9
Where does it say in OUR Constitution that my property can be taken from me at gunpoint to be given to someone else for funding the tutoring of ANYONE ANY REASON WHATSOEVER. Let's see...that's Article...hmmm...doesn't exist. How about that!

It seems that you have only selected one small slice of the problem to focus on. One can only speculate why.

190 posted on 11/30/2004 10:06:52 AM PST by Protagoras (Government exists to defend rights, nothing more.)
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To: Protagoras

Don't get paranoid...just being specific to the matter at hand. I'm a strict constitutionalist.


191 posted on 11/30/2004 10:39:52 AM PST by warchild9 (Please, refer to me as DOCTOR Warchild. I've got the certificate to prove it, now! Yipee!)
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To: warchild9
Don't get paranoid

I'm not paranoid at all. I just always wonder why people look past the big issues to the peripheral ones.

192 posted on 11/30/2004 10:44:27 AM PST by Protagoras (Government exists to defend rights, nothing more.)
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To: wagglebee

Separation of church and state? Fine. Let all Christian charitable organizations from here on in give aid only to Christians. And Jewish charitable organizations also.

Let's see how many Muslim and pagan and third world people in this country step up to give aid to EVERYONE, like Christian organizations like the Salvation Army and others do.

I hope none of these bastards ever come looking for aid.


193 posted on 11/30/2004 11:07:58 AM PST by Lijahsbubbe
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