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To: b2stealth
These probably proof that there is such a thing as a dumb question (but I have to ask):

What exactly is going on in the Ukraine? Are there any 'good guys'?

Aside from the natural national ambitions of the Ukrainian people and the long history of oppression under first the Czars and then the Soviets, is it in OUR national interest to back one side or the other?

No flames please -- I simply have not followed this story.

34 posted on 11/24/2004 9:17:26 AM PST by BenLurkin (Big government is still a big problem.)
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To: BenLurkin

I haven't been following this closer either. But it is in our national interest not to allow despotic empires anywhere in the world --especially in the age of WMD.


36 posted on 11/24/2004 9:22:16 AM PST by unspun (unspun.info | Did U work your precinct, churchmembers, etc. for good votes?)
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To: BenLurkin
Are there any 'good guys'?

Nope. Both are not-so-ex-Communists. The opposition was funded by George Soros, and has pledged to remove Ukrainian troops from Iraq. The incumbent party's candidate was backed by Putin.

38 posted on 11/24/2004 9:24:46 AM PST by Poohbah (Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!)
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To: BenLurkin

IMO in US interest is not allow to rebuild Soviet Union, it means that US should take Yuschenko’s side.


39 posted on 11/24/2004 9:26:16 AM PST by Lukasz (Terra Polonia Semper Fidelis!)
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To: BenLurkin
"What exactly is going on in the Ukraine?"

Ukraine is a deeply divided country. The western parts are mostly eastern rite Catholic with many ties to Poland and the West. The eastern part is more Orthodox and Russian and is oriented towards Russia.

Yushchenko was the candidate of the western part of Ukraine, while Yanukovych has his support in the east.

Here's a map from parliamentary (the Ukranian parliament is called the Rada) election voting trends in 1996 indicating general opposition to leftist policies. Note the concentration of the opposition to the western parts of Ukraine.

51 posted on 11/24/2004 9:50:13 AM PST by Truthsayer20
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To: BenLurkin
Here's another map from the 1999 presidential elections. Blue color indicates low support for the Communist candidate.


59 posted on 11/24/2004 9:58:22 AM PST by Truthsayer20
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To: BenLurkin
It is, quite literally, east versus west.

You have to know Ziggy Brzezinski and his hatred for all things Russian and Orthodox Christian to follow this completely.

Yuschenko is a puppet of both Ziggy and Soros, whom Russia despises.

Brezinski wrote a book called, I think, The Great Game, about using Ukraine to facililate the complete destruction of Russia.

61 posted on 11/24/2004 10:02:39 AM PST by MarMema
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To: BenLurkin
What exactly is going on in the Ukraine? Are there any 'good guys'?

Aside from the natural national ambitions of the Ukrainian people and the long history of oppression under first the Czars and then the Soviets, is it in OUR national interest to back one side or the other?

No flames please -- I simply have not followed this story.


I'll second that. I'm shrugging my shoulders here. I don't know enough of the players to know who is the good or the bad guys or all they just people with only a certain amount of good vs. bad in them? Do we have a choice that is only between "bad or worse?" I feel a bit dumb myself on this one, I don't know too much of what's going on there besides the strife.
83 posted on 11/24/2004 10:26:48 AM PST by Nowhere Man (We have enough youth, how about a Fountain of Smart?)
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To: BenLurkin
What exactly is going on in the Ukraine?

In brief - western Ukraine leans West and votes for Yushchenko, south/eastern Ukraine leans toward Russia and votes for Yanukovych. The vote is close enough to be questioned (quite likely both sides cheated a little in the regions they are strong).

Western leaders cheer for the pro-Western candidate and claim him to be the legitimate winner. Russians cheer for their guy and claim that elections were fair.

Since Kiev the capital is 75% for Yushchenko it is easy to stage "peaceful" mass demonstrations in order to remove the government with the bare hands. Since most of Ukrainians and Russians are similar and speak common language (Russian) it was easy to provide some elite Russian units to protect pro-Yanukovych government in the pro-Yushchenko to thwart "democratic" coup.

Now the game continues through the negotiations in which the cleverer will deceive the dumber (or weaker).

Are there any 'good guys'?

I am not sure.

228 posted on 11/26/2004 7:20:14 PM PST by A. Pole ("For the love of money is the root of all evil" -- II Timothy 6:10)
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