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To: naturalman1975
From the Wall Street Journal

In 1996, Britain banned handguns. The ban was so tight that even shooters training for the Olympics were forced to travel to other countries to practice. In the six years since the ban, gun crimes have risen by an astounding 40%. Britain now leads the U.S. by a wide margin in robberies and aggravated assaults. Although murder and rape rates are still lower than in the U.S., the difference is shrinking quickly. Dave Rogers, vice chairman of the Metropolitan Police Federation, said that, despite the ban, "the underground supply of guns does not seem to have dried up at all."

Australia also passed severe gun restrictions in 1996, banning most guns and making it a crime to use a gun defensively. In the subsequent four years, armed robberies rose by 51%, unarmed robberies by 37%, assaults by 24%, and kidnappings by 43%. While murders fell by 3%, manslaughter rose by 16%.

27 posted on 11/23/2004 3:01:27 PM PST by Carry_Okie (Privatizing government regulation is critical to national survival.)
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To: Carry_Okie
Apparently the WSJ writer don't know the difference between gun, handgun, and rifle.

There would've been a huge outcry if a large number of Aussies owned handguns: ain't so. Always too costly and even urban criminals in large part don't carry handguns: armed bank robbery and bikie gang "macho weapon of choice" is nearly always saw-off shotguns. Recently things have changed a bit with Sydney and Melbourne mid-eastern immigrant crime gangs importing/using illegal handguns and large magazine-fully auto stuff. Our cops only have 9mm glocks to fight back with in the main (except SWAT squadies). In a famous incident of 2002 the middle-eastern ghetto area of SW Sydney, the cop shop received a fully auto machine pistol drive by. The building and computers were shot up but the cops were missed (blind good luck). A special team was formed to go get 'em. They did.

Rifles are very popular by comparison to handguns. Lots of my holidays involved plinking with .22s and fox shooting and speaking now as a 46yo, I'm pretty representative of rifle users. Centrefire semi-autos, rimfire semi-autos, let alone any fully-auto, is now illegal. I think lever-action is okay though... if I was interested enough to be up on the small print I could tell you more. Ask me about Steyr F-88 drills and F89 Light Support Weapon drills though... (I'm an Army Reserve Digger but have never used weapons on the two way range).

33 posted on 11/23/2004 3:31:50 PM PST by rocknotsand ( "I don't want any messages saying we are holding our position... We're not holding anything!")
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To: Carry_Okie

Well, don't believe what you read in the Wall Street Journal mate.

I'm an Aussie. I live in Melbourne.

I own guns - in my case handguns and some basic rifles.

I have friends who own semi-automatic weapons. I know one person who owns at least fully automatic weapon.

We all do this completely and totally legally on civilian permits obtained under Australian and Victorian law.

The Wall Street Journal is wrong in its claims - very few guns are banned, and it is not a crime to use a gun defensively (though you would have to prove it court that the threat you faced justified the use of deadly force - you'd have to be able to show that you reasonably feared for your safety or that of others).

The 1996 restrictions basically changed things so that you have to have specific permits for specific reasons. If you have a basic permit, you can own basic rifles - if you want to own something else, you need to get the specific permit. They're not expensive - but they do take a bit of work to get through the bureaucracy.

Don't believe everything you read in the papers.

I think the crime figures they are reporting are off as well - but off the top of my head, I can't challenge them. I know the gun laws.


35 posted on 11/23/2004 3:35:10 PM PST by naturalman1975 (Sure, give peace a chance - but si vis pacem, para bellum.)
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