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To: SierraWasp
I've ridden (hours) in hydrogen-powered vehicles including those from Daimler-Chrysler, Toyota, Nissan, Volkswagon, Honda, GM and Hyundai. I've spoken with some of the engineers.

These vehicles are not all the same technology. They're not all on the same level of maturity either. GM, actually, was one of the best, with great power. Toyota, imho, had the edge with its retrofitted 4Runner. Hyundai retrofitted a Santa Fe. These aren't crap-boxes like GM's electric failure the EV-1. These are production SUVs but with a different powerplant.

With tens of millions of motor vehicles clogging the roads, California *MUST* think differently and I believe Arnold, who supports hydrogen as does President Bush, is doing the right thing. It's the *hot* technology among car companies' R&D and "big oil" companies as well. The West Sacramento hydrogen station is owned by BP, ChevronTexaco, Exxonmobil, Shell Hydrogen, Air Products and Praxair.

I thought we were FOR that kind of pro-business, pro-market, pro-innovation solution? The hydrogen can be sourced from fossil fuels like petroleum and natural gas but there are other possibilities including solar, wind or water power. There's also coal and biomass. This is a great potential: distribution of the source of hydrogen across a wide variety of source technologies. And we can do this *at home* and not have to be beholden to OPEC and other Mid-East interests for an eternity. This technology potentially underscores our sovereignty.

The Cities of Los Angeles & San Francisco actually have hydrogen powered vehicles (Hondas) in their fleet TODAY. Toyota & Honda have hydrogen R&D facilities located in Torrance and partnerships with UC Davis and UC Irvine.

There's no secret that there are really two sticking points: the battery technology (also an issue for electric and gas/electric hybrids) still can use work and manufacturing hydrogen for use as fuel can continue pollution problems. BUT there are many ways to extract the hydrogen. Check Shell Hydrogen's website here. Look at ChevronTexaco's here

Read about the California Fuel Cell Partnership. This is Arnold (and Bush), along with "Big Oil" and "Big Auto" thinking AHEAD for California, for Californians and for America in general along with Japan, German, Canada and other nations, rather than being stuck in the oil-warfare laden past. We should push AHEAD and support the "Hydrogen Economy" efforts by private business, academics and incentives from government.

30 posted on 11/20/2004 1:12:02 PM PST by newzjunkey ("The rule of law has become confused with - indeed subverted by - the rule of judges." - Robert Bork)
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To: newzjunkey
With tens of millions of motor vehicles clogging the roads, California *MUST* think differently

How will hydrogen help unclog roads? Hybrids are a successful transition technology and don't require multi-billion dollar government "investment" in infrastructure. The next logical step is to embed induction coils in select highways so hybrids can burn less and less gasoline. This could also act as a track so cars could join into virtual trains. Now that would do something about clogged roads.

44 posted on 11/20/2004 2:32:11 PM PST by Reeses
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To: newzjunkey; SierraWasp
"I thought we were FOR that kind of pro-business, pro-market, pro-innovation solution?"

Hydrogen isn't a solution, it is a stumbling block to freedom and mobility.

You're obviously not an engineer, or you could realize that we don't have a problem at all with our current method of propulsion. Our problems are political, and all stem from the election of socialists, who need problems to remain in power.

54 posted on 11/20/2004 5:43:53 PM PST by editor-surveyor (The Lord has given us President Bush; let's now turn this nation back to him)
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To: newzjunkey; calcowgirl; farmfriend; Carry_Okie; NormsRevenge; Dog Gone; BOBTHENAILER
Newsjunkey... That is the biggest pantload of propoganda based on supersillyous wishfull thinking by pseudo scientists spewing non-science non-sense in the history of the planet!!!

Have you ever seen a hydrogen fire? Of course you haven't because you can't see it burning you, you can only feel your skin turning to a krisp! The danged stuff is entirely too unstable, and volitile!!!

Plus, you can only go about 50 miles max on a fillup and I seriously doubt they're gonna put filling stations every 40-50 miles along Hwy 50 across NV, unless they can combine them with whore houses and casinos... Get offa this stupid Schwarzenrenegger pipe dream of a "Hydrogen Highway" and apply you mind to something feasible... Puuleeze!!!

74 posted on 11/21/2004 12:05:03 PM PST by SierraWasp ("Moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" - Barry Goldwater when he was in his right mind)
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To: newzjunkey

I am for market-based innovation--NOT government funding for it. Hydrogen is nothing but a huge government program waiting to happen.


82 posted on 11/21/2004 3:32:12 PM PST by LibertarianInExile (NO BLOOD FOR CHOCOLATE! Get the UN-ignoring, unilateralist Frogs out of Ivory Coast!)
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To: newzjunkey
And we can do this *at home* and not have to be beholden to OPEC and other Mid-East interests for an eternity. This technology potentially underscores our sovereignty.

This is very important. We can stop trading with the ME. The Islamocrazies can have their countries back and can roll the clock back to the seventh century when the camel was the ultimate SUV. We will live in the twenty-first century and ignore them.

121 posted on 12/18/2004 6:52:06 AM PST by reg45
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